cryingbluerain Posted March 29, 2013 Share Posted March 29, 2013 Anyone been watching this 10 hour series on The History Channel? Fascinating show whether you are religious or not. From executive producers Roma Downey (Touched By An Angel) and Mark Burnett (The Voice, Survivor, Shark Tank, Celebrity Apprentice). The final 2 episodes air on Easter Sunday, March 31 and then the series will be released on DVD on April 2nd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted March 29, 2013 Share Posted March 29, 2013 Anyone been watching this 10 hour series on The History Channel? Fascinating show whether you are religious or not. From executive producers Roma Downey (Touched By An Angel) and Mark Burnett (The Voice, Survivor, Shark Tank, Celebrity Apprentice). The final 2 episodes air on Easter Sunday, March 31 and then the series will be released on DVD on April 2nd. I wish I had seen it. Maybe I have before if it was previously shown? I will try and watch on Easter Sunday. There is more eveidence apparently to point in the direction that the Shroud of Turiin inddeed came from the time of Jesus. There is strong belief according to writings on the cloth that Jesus's body was indeed wrapped in this remarkable cloth. As a believer it is simply a miracle that it has survived fires and destruction and is further proof that it was indeed the cloth that covered our Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarius Rising Posted March 30, 2013 Share Posted March 30, 2013 I would prefer a bit more accuracy in the portrayal of Jesus, that is, how about someone who looks like a middle eastern guy since that was what Jesus was. During the 1st century the Jews had not yet cruised around Europe picking up all that European DNA and having them look all Jeff Goldblum. Back in the day they were dark, semitic peoples, no different than your modern Arab. So, the real historical Jesus (if he existed that is) would have looked just like some 7-11 cashier and around 5'3' since that was average height for semitic peoples during that era, and not like some Nazi's Aryan posterboy. Oh, and I preferred Scorsese's vision of satan to this couples ideal, I have dealt with 10 year old girls and they are indeed the spawn of satan!!! I also do not believe the shroud is authentic, the reason why??? Well, first of all a 6' tall Nordic / Celtic looking white guy in 1st century Palestine would have stuck out like a sore thumb and would have been written about extensively by non-biblical sources. I am sure Pilate himself would have said, "whoa there giant white man, I can't say if you are the Lord but you sure as hell look like Adonis so I gotta write this shit down in my daily report to Rome." Most likely the shroud is a representative art form made around the 14th century as this is precisely the time Jesus began being represented as European in appearance rather than arabic. Earlier representations of Jesus show him as a dark guy with middle eastern features. Gotta love the historical tweaks made by European, Renaissance artists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cryingbluerain Posted March 30, 2013 Author Share Posted March 30, 2013 Most likely the shroud is a representative art form made around the 14th century... The nature of the image and how it was fixed on the cloth remains a mystery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarius Rising Posted March 30, 2013 Share Posted March 30, 2013 ^ We don't know how they built the Pyramids or Machu Picchu, but that does not mean they were built by aliens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cryingbluerain Posted March 30, 2013 Author Share Posted March 30, 2013 We don't know how they built the Pyramids or Machu Picchu, but that does not mean they were built by aliens. Amen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slave to zep Posted March 30, 2013 Share Posted March 30, 2013 ^ We don't know how they built the Pyramids or Machu Picchu, but that does not mean they were built by aliens. but it doesn't mean they weren't ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redrum Posted March 30, 2013 Share Posted March 30, 2013 but it doesn't mean they weren't ...... I wonder if they 'probed' people back then? :^) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CF-tPZ23pMs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Posted March 30, 2013 Share Posted March 30, 2013 What a piece of shit this was. Not that I expect much from the History Channel these days, and in the entertainment world, the words "Produced by Mark Burnett" are slightly less scary than "from producer Michael Bay" or "from the mind of Harmony Korine". In fact, that is when the apocalypse will happen...when Mark Burnett, Michael Bay and Harmony Korine all join forces on a project. I watched the first two-hour episode and after seeing what an amateur-hour white-wash job it was going to be, I passed on watching the rest. Even if you don't believe in The Bible, it is still a great work of literature, with many great characters and stories, with great narrative arcs and themes...and not just a little bloodshed and violence. But you would never know it from Mark Burnett's treatment...it's been dumbed down for the lint-brained crowd. Anybody with even the slightest knowledge of religion and history will be flummoxed by the liberties taken in this History Channel version. You would be better off watching "Ben-Hur" or "The Ten Commandments". A complete travesty for believer and non-believer alike. I used to make a habit of regular checking out the History Channel when channel surfing, but lately it seems to be the sole province of the black helicopter brigade and people who like to laugh at dumb rednecks. So add another formerly good channel to the dustbin of history. Sayonara. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cryingbluerain Posted March 31, 2013 Author Share Posted March 31, 2013 I watched the first two-hour episode and after seeing what an amateur-hour white-wash job it was going to be, I passed on watching the rest. Your loss. The ratings for this show have been through the roof and many people are indeed enthusiastic about watching this mini-series regardless of what the critics and naysayers have to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redirtuo Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Awesome show! I just hope Rick gets to slay the Governor before Daryl builds the Ark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLee93 Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 I have been watching it. I do like it a lot, though they (obviously) change little things here and there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarius Rising Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 ^ Yeah, little things like Jesus being a tall white guy and the Sanhedrin running the show in Palestine. Just "little" inaccuracies like that. Nothing major... I have to agree with Slave, it is much more plausible to believe in alien intervention, especially in the Epic of Gilgamesh, er, I mean, "ark" story. The only logical explanation for gathering two of each creature onto an "ark" would be genetic samples. In other words the "ark" was either a orbital platform or an advance ship holding the genetic samples of all creatures. Once the disaster had passed, they re=created the animal species from the genetic material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slave to zep Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 ^ Yeah, little things like Jesus being a tall white guy and the Sanhedrin running the show in Palestine. Just "little" inaccuracies like that. Nothing major... I have to agree with Slave, it is much more plausible to believe in alien intervention, especially in the Epic of Gilgamesh, er, I mean, "ark" story. The only logical explanation for gathering two of each creature onto an "ark" would be genetic samples. In other words the "ark" was either a orbital platform or an advance ship holding the genetic samples of all creatures. Once the disaster had passed, they re=created the animal species from the genetic material. finally someone agrees with me .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLee93 Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 Haha to each his own I suppose! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slave to zep Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 I would prefer a bit more accuracy in the portrayal of Jesus, that is, how about someone who looks like a middle eastern guy since that was what Jesus was. During the 1st century the Jews had not yet cruised around Europe picking up all that European DNA and having them look all Jeff Goldblum. Back in the day they were dark, semitic peoples, no different than your modern Arab. So, the real historical Jesus (if he existed that is) would have looked just like some 7-11 cashier and around 5'3' since that was average height for semitic peoples during that era, and not like some Nazi's Aryan posterboy. Oh, and I preferred Scorsese's vision of satan to this couples ideal, I have dealt with 10 year old girls and they are indeed the spawn of satan!!! I also do not believe the shroud is authentic, the reason why??? Well, first of all a 6' tall Nordic / Celtic looking white guy in 1st century Palestine would have stuck out like a sore thumb and would have been written about extensively by non-biblical sources. I am sure Pilate himself would have said, "whoa there giant white man, I can't say if you are the Lord but you sure as hell look like Adonis so I gotta write this shit down in my daily report to Rome." Most likely the shroud is a representative art form made around the 14th century as this is precisely the time Jesus began being represented as European in appearance rather than arabic. Earlier representations of Jesus show him as a dark guy with middle eastern features. Gotta love the historical tweaks made by European, Renaissance artists. just watched a documentary on tv about a papyrus fragment that was found, and written on it are ( among other things ) "jesus said "my wife ....." and it is torn away .... some experts say that it is real, and because of the lettering ( coptic, i think they said it was called ) that there is no doubt that it was referring to THE jesus ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarius Rising Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 ^ The whole problem with biblical history is it is anything but. Kinda like calling Grimm's Fairy Tales non-fiction. The facts are no one knows if Jesus was married or even existed since there is zero reference to Jesus in non-biblical sources. Many proponents will argue that Josephus (1st century Jewish historian and Roman apologist-propagandist), in his Antiquities of the Jews, did indeed mention a "Jesus" in a single short sentence. That sentence said, "There was a holy man named Yehoshua ben Yosef (Jesus is a Greek bastardization of Yehoshua as there is no Hebrew or Greek name Jesus) who ministered for a time in the Galilee, gathered many followers and was said to perform miracles who was killed by the Roman authority. That's it, and, it has proven to be a forgery, it was never in the Antiquities. The fact is there are at least four known "messiahs" who were ministering various messages and claiming to be the fulfillment of Daniel's prophecy in the 1st century. These four were notated in historical documents of the time from reputable historians like Pliny but no one knows their names today outside of theologian circles. Who knows, maybe Jesus was married and fathered children, maybe he was not. The reality is who cares? I have a minister friend of mine and I asked him a basic question regarding the importance of the divinity of Jesus, my question was as follows: What would have a greater historical and societal impact? If Jesus came, did all sorts of amazing miracles, defeated the Romans, and re-established the line of Davidic kings but, never said a word and then ascended into heaven. Or, if a simple man were born to a simple family (no angel, no virgin, no magi) and grew to establish an amazing ministry with a revolutionary message of love and forgiveness, then married, had children, and died of old age. My friend has always the later, words transcend time and affect generations; miracles affect only those who witness the miracle and subsequent generations don't care, will not believe, or simply forget. For me Jesus was the message, the divinity, even if he was (which I do not believe) is both irrelevant and has no bearing. If you are a god it is easy to be all godlike, no miracle there, but if you are a man (or woman) and you reach such levels of enlightenment, well, there is no greater miracle on earth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 Well put, SR! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slave to zep Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 ^ wow, you sure know your stuff, SR! it's all greek to me, lol i was just wondering how people who believe in jesus would react to all this. jesus married? kids? dan brown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 ^ The whole problem with biblical history is it is anything but. Kinda like calling Grimm's Fairy Tales non-fiction. The facts are no one knows if Jesus was married or even existed since there is zero reference to Jesus in non-biblical sources. Many proponents will argue that Josephus (1st century Jewish historian and Roman apologist-propagandist), in his Antiquities of the Jews, did indeed mention a "Jesus" in a single short sentence. That sentence said, "There was a holy man named Yehoshua ben Yosef (Jesus is a Greek bastardization of Yehoshua as there is no Hebrew or Greek name Jesus) who ministered for a time in the Galilee, gathered many followers and was said to perform miracles who was killed by the Roman authority. That's it, and, it has proven to be a forgery, it was never in the Antiquities. The fact is there are at least four known "messiahs" who were ministering various messages and claiming to be the fulfillment of Daniel's prophecy in the 1st century. These four were notated in historical documents of the time from reputable historians like Pliny but no one knows their names today outside of theologian circles. Who knows, maybe Jesus was married and fathered children, maybe he was not. The reality is who cares? I have a minister friend of mine and I asked him a basic question regarding the importance of the divinity of Jesus, my question was as follows: What would have a greater historical and societal impact? If Jesus came, did all sorts of amazing miracles, defeated the Romans, and re-established the line of Davidic kings but, never said a word and then ascended into heaven. Or, if a simple man were born to a simple family (no angel, no virgin, no magi) and grew to establish an amazing ministry with a revolutionary message of love and forgiveness, then married, had children, and died of old age. My friend has always the later, words transcend time and affect generations; miracles affect only those who witness the miracle and subsequent generations don't care, will not believe, or simply forget. For me Jesus was the message, the divinity, even if he was (which I do not believe) is both irrelevant and has no bearing. If you are a god it is easy to be all godlike, no miracle there, but if you are a man (or woman) and you reach such levels of enlightenment, well, there is no greater miracle on earth. I strongly disagree with your take on such things being irrelevant. But I am not going to get sucked into a religous argument. There are other references to the existence of Jesus historically and whether you are a believer or not, the non believers never doubted that he in fact did live for approx 33 years and die on the cross. Their only argument pertains to the resurrection and the facts around him ascending into heaven. And of course the miracles of the Bible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLee93 Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 I agree with LedZeppfan77. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarius Rising Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 I strongly disagree with your take on such things being irrelevant. But I am not going to get sucked into a religous argument. There are other references to the existence of Jesus historically and whether you are a believer or not, the non believers never doubted that he in fact did live for approx 33 years and die on the cross. Their only argument pertains to the resurrection and the facts around him ascending into heaven. And of course the miracles of the Bible. No worries, it's good to have a different opinion and I respect yours. However you are wrong regarding the existence of Jesus as there is no, I mean zero reference to Jesus outside of the bible. He is mentioned nowhere in historical documents of the era. Does that mean I believe he did not exist? No, actually I do believe he existed simply because of certain details contained in the letters from St. Paul and a very early manuscript of Mark which was recently discovered. I believe the reason there is no extra-biblical record of Jesus is because he was a local phenomenon who did pretty much everything we currently know of within the Galilee area of Palestine...not many educated historians in that area back then. Also, the destruction of the Temple in 66ad may have also seen the destruction of possible historical accounts of Jesus. So that is my two cents. Though if you ever come across hard core theologians who do not believe in the existence of Jesus, that is exactly where they will point for the foundation of their argument which to me is a bit one dimensional in thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slave to zep Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 i am learning so much from these threads! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagittarius Rising Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 I am such a history nerd...gotta get out of the house more! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishhead Posted April 5, 2013 Share Posted April 5, 2013 ^ The whole problem with biblical history is it is anything but. Kinda like calling Grimm's Fairy Tales non-fiction. The facts are no one knows if Jesus was married or even existed since there is zero reference to Jesus in non-biblical sources. Many proponents will argue that Josephus (1st century Jewish historian and Roman apologist-propagandist), in his Antiquities of the Jews, did indeed mention a "Jesus" in a single short sentence. That sentence said, "There was a holy man named Yehoshua ben Yosef (Jesus is a Greek bastardization of Yehoshua as there is no Hebrew or Greek name Jesus) who ministered for a time in the Galilee, gathered many followers and was said to perform miracles who was killed by the Roman authority. That's it, and, it has proven to be a forgery, it was never in the Antiquities. The fact is there are at least four known "messiahs" who were ministering various messages and claiming to be the fulfillment of Daniel's prophecy in the 1st century. These four were notated in historical documents of the time from reputable historians like Pliny but no one knows their names today outside of theologian circles. Who knows, maybe Jesus was married and fathered children, maybe he was not. The reality is who cares? I have a minister friend of mine and I asked him a basic question regarding the importance of the divinity of Jesus, my question was as follows: What would have a greater historical and societal impact? If Jesus came, did all sorts of amazing miracles, defeated the Romans, and re-established the line of Davidic kings but, never said a word and then ascended into heaven. Or, if a simple man were born to a simple family (no angel, no virgin, no magi) and grew to establish an amazing ministry with a revolutionary message of love and forgiveness, then married, had children, and died of old age. My friend has always the later, words transcend time and affect generations; miracles affect only those who witness the miracle and subsequent generations don't care, will not believe, or simply forget. For me Jesus was the message, the divinity, even if he was (which I do not believe) is both irrelevant and has no bearing. If you are a god it is easy to be all godlike, no miracle there, but if you are a man (or woman) and you reach such levels of enlightenment, well, there is no greater miracle on earth. ...love what you wrote here SR....``For me Jesus was the message, the divinity, even if he was (which I do not believe) is both irrelevant and has no bearing. If you are a god it is easy to be all godlike, no miracle there, but if you are a man (or woman) and you reach such levels of enlightenment, well, there is no greater miracle on earth.`` I also do agree with, what I think you were saying, about the historical interpretations of handed handed down messages from one man or woman to another. It would be hard to believe that those messages and stories would remain consistent throughout the last 2000 plus years. Especially the way we can alter things for our own selfish agendas. I mean, we could get 20 of our Led Zep forum members in one room and play a little game of `broken telephone`to prove how bad humans are a consistant and accurate communication..... anyway, I am respectful of what other people believe or don`t believe. I am not a bible expert and don;t really want to be one either. I think I have the basics and try to be as good as I can, which is a struggle. I have chosen Jesus (or whatever he really is) to ride along with me day to day but I am sure he is cringing every once in a while. Enlightenment, regardless of religion, is something great to strive for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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