Divided by a common language

[bouillon]

It's been reported that Cheryl Cole, our delectable but frankly unintelligible Geordie poppet, has been stood down as a judge on American X Factor, apparently due to concerns that the Yanks would be unable to understand what she was saying.

So, had the series even started over there? And if you saw it, could you understand her?

Regional dialects are far more diverse and bizarre over here than in the US, a much bigger country. This has led to much mirth and merriment, particularly between northern & southern football supporters. Many's the time I've visited football grounds in the North-East, and joined in the chants of 'We speak English, we speak English, you don't! You don't!' And I once had a Scottish customer put the phone down on me in frustration, after I'd repeatedly said 'Pardon?', because I genuinely couldn't understand him.

So, do you ever have the same problem with your hillbilly compatriots, for example? And do we all sound the same to you? Even the Jocks and the Brummies?

[spidersandsnakes]

Being in the lingo and interpreter/translator biz myself, I'm pretty well accustomed to hearing diff accents and dialects. I can understand most Americans when they speak because I used to listen to loads of American bands from the 60s on In Australia. The thing that surprised me was listening to Mick Jagger singing with a high American twang in many of his later songs:):)!!!!!

[BIGDAN]

It's been reported that Cheryl Cole, our delectable but frankly unintelligible Geordie poppet, has been stood down as a judge on American X Factor, apparently due to concerns that the Yanks would be unable to understand what she was saying.

So, had the series even started over there? And if you saw it, could you understand her?

Regional dialects are far more diverse and bizarre over here than in the US, a much bigger country. This has led to much mirth and merriment, particularly between northern & southern football supporters. Many's the time I've visited football grounds in the North-East, and joined in the chants of 'We speak English, we speak English, you don't! You don't!' And I once had a Scottish customer put the phone down on me in frustration, after I'd repeatedly said 'Pardon?', because I genuinely couldn't understand him.

So, do you ever have the same problem with your hillbilly compatriots, for example? And do we all sound the same to you? Even the Jocks and the Brummies?

Hi Bouillon,

I knew it would never work, Ant the Plank and Decking also couldnt be understood, could you imagin Gazza working on TV anywhere outside Newcastle? well i couldnt.

The trouble with TV is that it is a world wide media now, local, quaint dialects are very hard to understand outside there catchment area let alone in another country.

I want to hear a person with an Educated Middle Class English Accent akin to Oxford English, not Scotch, Irish, Welcher, West Indian, Asian, Cockney, Scouse, Geordie, Brummie or whatever, Trevor McDonnald will do for me as a starting point, a West Indian who speaks like a Toff, thats what i would like to see presenting all shows in England, including the News and Weather, regardless of Race, Colour or Creed, not some Ignorant Yocal Bimbo like Mizzzz Cole who WILL not take elocution lessons to help US understand whet the hell message she is trying to get across, and i emphasise the word TRYING.

At least with America you can understand most of what people say, they WANT to be understood for the most part especially on TV, what language there Local Youth speak is another matter though, a problem we all have everywhere, "Rap is Crap and i'de be Hap to give it a Slap".

Regards, Danny

[Electrophile]

I've never heard an unintelligible accent in this country, but that's me. I don't think all English people sound the same either, since just like the United States, you have dialects. For example, Prince William's wife Catherine is from Berkshire, and she doesn't have the same accent as Paul McCartney does, who is from Liverpool. He doesn't have the same accent as David Gilmour, who is from Cambridge.

Just like I'm from Chicago so my accent is different from someone born in Boston, whose accent is different than someone born in Alabama.

[spidersandsnakes]

But in another way I have noticed that in many infomercials the pitchmen are guys with Australian accents. I've heard that in marketing they have figured out that Americans are drawn to the Austrailian accent and will tune in to hear what is being said over other accents.

I knew that Australia is one of the very few Anglo-Saxon COUNTRIES WHERE there is no marked diff in accents and intonation between north south east and west. That is, you can't tell if someone came from Sydney or Darwin or Adelaide or Geelong:):)

[BIGDAN]

I knew that Australia is one of the very few Anglo-Saxon COUNTRIES WHERE there is no marked diff in accents and intonation between north south east and west. That is, you can't tell if someone came from Sydney or Darwin or Adelaide or Geelong:):)

"Yer not rong there cobber."

Another example of a people that WANT to be understood, unlike many English accents where the people use their accents like a code to bamboozle the rozzers, like Cockney Rhyming Slang for instance.

Regards, Danny

[Ady]

I thought of this scene from I'm Alan Partridge when the story broke.

[Virginia]

I can understand her. I don't know all the dialects/accents in the UK by name, but I definitely hear the differences.

Same with the US; we were talking a while back on another thread about the different southern accents. There are several very distinct accents within Virginia alone.

This site looked kind of fun: How to speak southern

[bouillon]

I want to hear a person with an Educated Middle Class English Accent akin to Oxford English, not Scotch, Irish, Welcher, West Indian, Asian, Cockney, Scouse, Geordie, Brummie or whatever

Couldn't agree more, Bigdan. Over recent years (and it's largely Big Brother's fault), there has been a proliferation of Geordie accents on national TV & radio. Some say, 'Well, it's a warm, friendly accent', blah blah...Ha! Try telling that to anyone who's had their teeth knocked out in Geordieland just for looking at some cheery chappie's pint.

And they even think their accents are correct. When we moved to the Midlands a few years ago from the Beautiful South, my young kids were often asked by their yam-yam Benny schoolmates, 'Why do you talk funny?' Er, sorry, we don't, YOU do. Ever heard of 'Received Pronunciation?' No? Thought not.

Even worse is the media-creep of 'footballer-speak'. Time was when the BBC was the bastion of correct grammar & syntax. But now, you get these overpaid footy tarts spreading their ignorance via the media, so that even the presenters are getting infected. Colin Murray's a case in point. To add insult to his injuriously irritating Irish bonhomie, he's a heavy user of fcuktard-speak such as 'They've went down', etc. WTF? This isn't what I pay my licence fee to hear.

Grrr......

[spidersandsnakes]

those pommy bastards said my Austrailian friend..

:D :D

[BIGDAN]

Couldn't agree more, Bigdan. Over recent years (and it's largely Big Brother's fault), there has been a proliferation of Geordie accents on national TV & radio. Some say, 'Well, it's a warm, friendly accent', blah blah...Ha! Try telling that to anyone who's had their teeth knocked out in Geordieland just for looking at some cheery chappie's pint.

And they even think their accents are correct. When we moved to the Midlands a few years ago from the Beautiful South, my young kids were often asked by their yam-yam Benny schoolmates, 'Why do you talk funny?' Er, sorry, we don't, YOU do. Ever heard of 'Received Pronunciation?' No? Thought not.

Even worse is the media-creep of 'footballer-speak'. Time was when the BBC was the bastion of correct grammar & syntax. But now, you get these overpaid footy tarts spreading their ignorance via the media, so that even the presenters are getting infected. Colin Murray's a case in point. To add insult to his injuriously irritating Irish bonhomie, he's a heavy user of fcuktard-speak such as 'They've went down', etc. WTF? This isn't what I pay my licence fee to hear.

Grrr......

I couldnt agree more 'bouillon',

I to have had my dealings with other cultures as well, Middlesborough, Bristol, Liverpool, Newcastle, all have had the priviledge to decipher my Cockney Banter.

Where do you put the blame? the BBC? Certainly, they are not holding up the British Tradition of good speach on TV although what can they do about regional dialects? keep them regional, keep them off of what goes out to the whole country, the world in fact.

And predictive texting, many of our children dont have a clue as to how to address a letter or even the formality of writing one, MSN, Facebook, all have been vehicles for bad grammer, even here, why there are even people who do not introduce themselves at the start of a message and never sign off with any "REGARDS".

Where are the Kenneth Wolstenholmes? the David Colemans? the Brian Moores? we are treated to people whos accent is so colloquial that an interpreter is sometimes needed, which is why IF i can be bothered to watch Footy i record it and during playback i fast forward through all the idol chatter to the action, and sometimes even that aint worth the bother.

As for paying, apart from the TV licence i havent spent a penny on Football since the late 80s, so all those millions they could have had from me has been spent at the local DIY store, and there still not bankrupt in Football? there must be a lots of fools out there still.

Regards, Danny

[BIGDAN]

PS, And what about "Saint and Greavesie" the best double act even to grace our Footy TV screens.

"You kill me Greavesie"

Regards, Danny

[Knebby]

Couldn't agree more, Bigdan. Over recent years (and it's largely Big Brother's fault), there has been a proliferation of Geordie accents on national TV & radio. Some say, 'Well, it's a warm, friendly accent', blah blah...Ha! Try telling that to anyone who's had their teeth knocked out in Geordieland just for looking at some cheery chappie's pint.

And they even think their accents are correct. When we moved to the Midlands a few years ago from the Beautiful South, my young kids were often asked by their yam-yam Benny schoolmates, 'Why do you talk funny?' Er, sorry, we don't, YOU do. Ever heard of 'Received Pronunciation?' No? Thought not.

Even worse is the media-creep of 'footballer-speak'. Time was when the BBC was the bastion of correct grammar & syntax. But now, you get these overpaid footy tarts spreading their ignorance via the media, so that even the presenters are getting infected. Colin Murray's a case in point. To add insult to his injuriously irritating Irish bonhomie, he's a heavy user of fcuktard-speak such as 'They've went down', etc. WTF? This isn't what I pay my licence fee to hear.

Grrr......

Good God, you're ignorant.

[Silver Rider]

Couldn't agree more, Bigdan. Over recent years (and it's largely Big Brother's fault), there has been a proliferation of Geordie accents on national TV & radio. Some say, 'Well, it's a warm, friendly accent', blah blah...Ha! Try telling that to anyone who's had their teeth knocked out in Geordieland just for looking at some cheery chappie's pint.

And they even think their accents are correct. When we moved to the Midlands a few years ago from the Beautiful South, my young kids were often asked by their yam-yam Benny schoolmates, 'Why do you talk funny?' Er, sorry, we don't, YOU do. Ever heard of 'Received Pronunciation?' No? Thought not.

Even worse is the media-creep of 'footballer-speak'. Time was when the BBC was the bastion of correct grammar & syntax. But now, you get these overpaid footy tarts spreading their ignorance via the media, so that even the presenters are getting infected. Colin Murray's a case in point. To add insult to his injuriously irritating Irish bonhomie, he's a heavy user of fcuktard-speak such as 'They've went down', etc. WTF? This isn't what I pay my licence fee to hear.

Grrr......

Ah, the good old days, when people just wouldn't talk right. Reminds me of that nice English lady who looked after me when I was little. I did my very best to explain to her how to talk right, as any conscientious four-year-old would when speaking to a woman in her sixties. Sadly, she kept on calling trash "rubbish" and all my earnest efforts fell on deaf ears.

I guess they still speak Saxon in the south and Merican in the Midlands.

The Great Melting Pot of Language

A History of the English Language

The history of English is a complex and dynamic history. It is often, albeit perhaps too neatly, divided into four periods: Old English, Middle English, Early-Modern English, and Late-Modern English. English is classified genetically as a Low West Germanic language of the Indo-European family of languages. Currently, nearly two billion people around the globe understand it. It is the language of aviation, science, computing, international trade, and diplomacy. It holds a crucial place in the cultural, political, and economic affairs in countries all over the world. From its early beginnings as a series of Germanic dialects, English has been remarkable in both its colonizing power and its ability to adopt and amass vocabulary from all over the world. Yet it was nearly wiped out in its early years (Bragg 2003).

Old English (500-1100AD)

It is nearly impossible to identify the birth of a language, but in the case of English, it is safe to say that it did not exist before the West Germanic tribes settled Britain. During the fifth and sixth centuries A.D., West Germanic tribes from Jutland and southern Denmark (Norseland) invaded the British Isles. These tribes--which included the Angles, Saxons, and Jutes--spoke a Germanic language now termed Old English, a language which is similar to modern Frisian. Out of these tribes, four major dialects of Old English emerged, Northumbrian in the north of England, Merican in the Midlands, West Saxon in the south and west, and Kentish in the Southeast. These tribes, along with the English language, may well have been wiped out altogether by Viking raiders if not for a Wessex king named Alfred the Great. After defeating the Vikings, who threatened both the English way of life and its language, Alfred the Great encouraged English literacy throughout his kingdom (McCrum, et al 1986).

randomhistory.com

[Janet]

Two difficult US accents - Southwest Maine and North Carolina. I'm sure there are many accents in NC, but a lady I met from there said the word "hair" as Hayyyyyyah. I had no idea what she was talking about when she asked me, How laong is yo hayyyah?

[bouillon]

Good God, you're ignorant.

You're the first person who's ever said that to me. Which either means everyone else is wrong, or you are

On the other hand, I might not be very PC, but I don't aspire to be. I just don't enjoy watching 'Albion' slowly disappearing down the toilet. You, however, are perfectly welcome to .

[Silver Rider]

I don't know what a "footy tart" is but I like that sound of that one. I'm going to have to start using it myself.

It's a term for a female sports fan with a busy social schedule.

It could also refer to a person who changes support to a different team after his/her team loses a game (an unfaithful fan.)

source: urban dictionary, other forums

[bouillon]

^ Neither of the above. Just a football player, that's all. Soccer.

With few exceptions - notably Graeme Le Saux, who was dismissed by his peers as being a 'ponce' for speaking properly and visiting art galleries - most of our overpaid prima donna footballers are incapable of stringing a coherent sentence together without bastardising their tenses or similar grammatical atrocities. It's almost as if they're sent to a special school as part of their training, to un-learn their mother tongue, and they're not allowed anywhere near a reporter until they're suitably dumbed down

[Silver Rider]

^ Neither of the above. Just a football player, that's all. Soccer.

With few exceptions - notably Graeme Le Saux, who was dismissed by his peers as being a 'ponce' for speaking properly and visiting art galleries - most of our overpaid prima donna footballers are incapable of stringing a coherent sentence together without bastardising their tenses or similar grammatical atrocities. It's almost as if they're sent to a special school as part of their training, to un-learn their mother tongue, and they're not allowed anywhere near a reporter until they're suitably dumbed down

What we would call a soccer player.

[bouillon]

So what is a "yam yam"?

A yam yam is someone from the Black Country, an area in the West Midlands famed for its comical accent.

You didn't ask about 'Benny'. Benny was a character in Crossroads, one of the worst Brit soap operas, set in Birmingham, and now mercifully defunct. He was a yam yam, and this is what he looked like:

The tea-cosy hat was a permanent fixture . Inexplicably, this look was later adopted by Dexy's Midnight Runners .

[Walesdad]

A yam yam is someone from the Black Country, an area in the West Midlands famed for its comical accent.

You didn't ask about 'Benny'. Benny was a character in Crossroads, one of the worst Brit soap operas, set in Birmingham, and now mercifully defunct. He was a yam yam, and this is what he looked like:

The tea-cosy hat was a permanent fixture

I have to give a smirk every time I hear a proper yam yam talking,the accent is marvellous.Even when they are ecstatic they sound like they have just lost the winning lottery ticket.

[bouillon]

Are there any famous people who are considered yam yams?

What, Benny's not famous enough for you?

Our beloved RP could be considered a yam yam. But his parents were quite posh, and he went to a grammar school, so he probably had the more jarring elements of the accent trained (or more likely thrashed) out of him.

See Wiki for a deeper examination of the phenomenon - including a translation of this:

[Walesdad]

What, Benny's not famous enough for you?

Our beloved RP could be considered a yam yam. But his parents were quite posh, and he went to a grammar school, so he probably had the more jarring elements of the accent trained (or more likely thrashed) out of him.

See Wiki for a deeper examination of the phenomenon - including a translation of this:

Although I've heard Mr. Plant drop into it now and again in interviews,I'm sure it would have been thumped out of him at school,as you've said.I love the study of accent's myself and the fact that two people from just a few miles apart can sound so different.

[Silver Rider]

Thanks, it all makes some sense now. I always thought the Zep song "Black Country Woman" was probably about an American black woman from the south or near the Mississippi river area. I just figured that since so many Zep songs had a delta blues influence that just was the reason for the song. But it bothered me that the song had no blues sound to it.

Now I get it after all these years.

Zeppelin's Black Country Woman reminds me more of Tammy Wynette's D-I-V-O-R-C-E for some reason.

[spidersandsnakes]

Soccer IS a bit of a sport for 'tarts':)