Eddie Van Halen slamming Page

[JohnOsbourne]

EVH's negative comments on Page's live playing are well-known, as is the genesis of the "Listen to this Eddie" bootleg title.  I'd always assumed Van Halen was referring to a '77 performance, but this comment here claims it was based on the '72 Forum show:

http://www.royal-orleans.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13691&start=12625#p892618

There was also a June 25th show in LA '77, so maybe this is a typo;  does anyone know the actual date where Van Halen saw them (and was apparently unimpressed)?  Thanks in advance.

 

[Bozoso73]

EVH would have been 17 in 72 so I dont think it could be from that date.  Plus that's a killer show.  Plus plus it could be Eddie Kramer so there is that angle.  

Edited November 13, 2018 by Bozoso73

[Mithril46]

I just have to point something out in case it's not known. I have a few EVH interviews from the late 80's on, and Eddie doesn't

quite take back his earlier statements. But he does say he would love to get inside Jimmy's brain to see how he came up with

his brilliant compositions, and also says when Jimmy solos, he speaks. But then Eddie says Jimmy also doesn't always pull off

or execute his ideas live, and to some degree I think Eddie has a point. Interestingly enough, although Eddie has incredible chops, if you listen to early live VH boots, Eddie often plays incredibly raw AND sometimes has to cut a solo short to get back

to the song, just like Jimmy sometimes.

[Bozoso73]

He definately had a point😎 You said you have the interviews Iwould like to read some of that if at all possible.  I always heard he talked shit but never saw any interview where he is blasting JP.

[Strider]

A rehash of a rehash. Not even worth discussing anymore. And for the millionth time, "Listen to this, Eddie" was not named in reference to Eddie Van Halen.

[pluribus]

20 minutes ago, Strider said:

And for the millionth time, "Listen to this, Eddie" was not named in reference to Eddie Van Halen.

Why so sure? 

[Strider]

15 minutes ago, pluribus said:

Why so sure? 

Because the Eddie quotes weren't made public until after the bootleg came out.

[pluribus]

2 hours ago, Strider said:

Because the Eddie quotes weren't made public until after the bootleg came out.

I think the timeline still fits with Van Halen. The Eddie bootleg was released 1984-1985 (according to discogs and bootlegpedia), and the Van Halen quote about Page was  in Guitar World, January 1981 (according to wiki). 

[badgeholder]

I believe Mike Millard had a friend named Eddie who he shared his recording with, hence the title.

[JTM]

9 hours ago, pluribus said:

I think the timeline still fits with Van Halen. The Eddie bootleg was released 1984-1985 (according to discogs and bootlegpedia), and the Van Halen quote about Page was  in Guitar World, January 1981 (according to wiki). 

Van Halen (1) wasn't released until 1978 so who knew EVH in 77. I thought the title was directed at the Eddie at the Garden Tapes.

Edited November 13, 2018 by JTM

[jsj]

On my copy of listen to this Eddie it states the title is a reference to Eddie Kramer 

[JTM]

27 minutes ago, jsj said:

On my copy of listen to this Eddie it states the title is a reference to Eddie Kramer 

EK has nothing to worry about then, LTTE  is ok but it’s not that great, IMO.

[pluribus]

50 minutes ago, JTM said:

Van Halen (1) wasn't released until 1978 so who knew EVH in 77. I thought the title was directed at the Eddie at the Garden Tapes.

Listen to This Eddie wasn’t released until 1984, when Van Halen was huge. Far more likely to have the bootleg be about a current hitmaker who had made negative comments about the band’s live ability than for the title to be about a record producer from the 1960s. On top of the fact that the Eddie title doesn’t even make sense as it relates to Kramer. “Listen to this”, for what? To hear how good the recording sounds? That’s a stretch. Van Halen had specifically talked trash on Page’s live ability, and if you got in a time machine back to 1984 and said “I’m a big Eddie fan”, everyone from children to housewives would know that you were referring to Eddie Van Halen.

[pluribus]

1 hour ago, jsj said:

On my copy of listen to this Eddie it states the title is a reference to Eddie Kramer 

There was only one original vinyl issue of Listen to This Eddie, on Rock Solid Records. It makes no mention of Kramer. There have since been 50,000+ different versions of the show on CD. Those discs can say whatever they want, and often take reviews from online. Doesn’t make the story true. Half of those bootlegs always say “Direct from the Master”, for instance.

[gibsonfan159]

17 hours ago, Bozoso73 said:

EVH would have been 17 in 72 so I dont think it could be from that date.  Plus that's a killer show.  Plus plus it could be Eddie Kramer so there is that angle.  

There's an interview where he says he and Alex went to the Forum to see Zep and that's where he saw Jimmy do the tapping technique during Heartbreaker. That would more than likely be either 71 or 72.

[pluribus]

15 minutes ago, gibsonfan159 said:

There's an interview where he says he and Alex went to the Forum to see Zep and that's where he saw Jimmy do the tapping technique during Heartbreaker. That would more than likely be either 71 or 72.

I would imagine that the Van Halen brothers saw Zeppelin multiple times between 1970-1977. 

[gibsonfan159]

9 minutes ago, pluribus said:

I would imagine that the Van Halen brothers saw Zeppelin multiple times between 1970-1977. 

In the late 1970s, Eddie Van Halen popularized the two-handed tapping technique. Van Halen claims that his own inspiration came from Jimmy Page: "I think I got the idea of tapping watching (Page) do his "Heartbreaker" solo back in 1971… He was doing a pull-off to an open string and I thought… I can do that, but what if I use my finger as the nut and move it around?"

 

[badgeholder]

8 minutes ago, pluribus said:

I would imagine that the Van Halen brothers saw Zeppelin multiple times between 1970-1977. 

I know they were both there on 3/24/75. It was funny, I bump into Ed pre-show (we were friends) on the concourse, and Al comes walking up to report on Bonzo's bass drum: "No muffling. Wooden beater". But I still don't think it was a reference to EVH, I don't remember where I read it (probably at RO) but Millard was telling his friend Eddie to LISTEN TO THIS! 

[gibsonfan159]

7 minutes ago, badgeholder said:

 Millard was telling his friend Eddie to LISTEN TO THIS! 

That sounds like the most likely scenario to me. However, if they saw that show on the 24th I could certainly understand if Eddie criticized him lol.

[Strider]

6 hours ago, badgeholder said:

I believe Mike Millard had a friend named Eddie who he shared his recording with, hence the title.

That's what I have been saying for decades. Glad to have you on my side.

15 hours ago, pluribus said:

I think the timeline still fits with Van Halen. The Eddie bootleg was released 1984-1985 (according to discogs and bootlegpedia), and the Van Halen quote about Page was  in Guitar World, January 1981 (according to wiki). 

Maybe the vinyl of LTTE did not get released until 1984-85, but the tapes had been circulating for years. I got a cassette copy of the June 23, 1977 show in 1978. The following year, the same guy who got me the Badgeholders Only show hooked me up with a cassette of June 21, 1977. All of this was before any of Van Halen's Page comments.

"Listen to this, Eddie" was what Mike Millard wrote on one of the cassette copies he sent out. It was not a title created by bootleg companies. Unless Mike was personally sending that tape to Eddie Van Halen or Eddie Kramer, the only explanation that makes sense is that Mike Millard made the tape for a friend named Eddie.

Edited November 14, 2018 by Strider

[Mithril46]

Page was known to be a bit inconsistent even at excellent/great shows. First Eddie said Jimmy played like he had broken fingers. Although around the same time EVH did mention Zep l and Zep ll were great albums. Later on as I said Eddie did praise

Page as a visionary if a bit erratic technically. Also, it's rock solid that no one except Millard ever heard the 6/21/77 show before

the "official release" in 83'-84' ? Of course Millard is the man, but you're talking underground and bootleg stuff. I'm sure some

bootleg fans don't even realize that in Zep's time the original sources for shows were small tape recorders, ?? small reel to reels ??, a few boards, and taping a vinyl boot !!!( possible EQ tweaks, fake stereo, noise reduction, blah, blah.). So when was "Destroyer"(the 27th, a weak show) officially released ? I saw it in a few record stores and flea markets, 4-disc vinyl set. Strider by the way made some excellent points, some of these shows were circulating not that much later than the shows themselves.

Edited November 14, 2018 by Mithril46
Revision

[pluribus]

6 hours ago, badgeholder said:

I believe Mike Millard had a friend named Eddie who he shared his recording with, hence the title.

That story has been around for a long time. The fact is that Millard hated bootlegging. There are accounts from friends of his who specifically point this out. When the first bootlegs appeared with his recordings on them, he was not happy. Millard only sent his tapes to other tapers/traders, and his artwork always had photocopies of his ticket stubs and his “Mike the Mic” artwork on them. 

The dude who ran Rock Solid Records was in the same circles as the guys behind Trademark of Quality. There’s no chance they were given a tape by Millard. Worlds apart. The Rock Solid Record bootlegs used the same type of tongue-in-cheek titles as the TMOQ bootlegs did. Titles like Duckwalks and Lasers, Custard Pie, Live on the Levee. They always had something to do with the band or the show. So any reference to some friend of Millard’s named “Eddie” wouldn’t make any sense to anyone. I promise you that the guys who made the Eddie bootleg had no knowledge of who Mike Millard was. All they had was an 8 year old tape passed around for years. And their copy was incomplete too. If the bootleggers really had known Mike, or a reliable connection to his recordings, they would’ve released many more of his tapes. The fact that all they got was a fragment of 6/21/77 is proof enough of how far removed they were from the source. 

Edited November 14, 2018 by pluribus

[Mithril46]

Well this just shows how chaotic the "bootleg world" can be, interesting stuff I and many others had probably not known.

Also even Zep had to use audience shot footage in the HTWWW at points. Without boots and all these smoke and mirrors

scenarios, you'd lose a lot of fun and adventure, and probably some cash on unscrupulous operators.

[Strider]

4 hours ago, Mithril46 said:

Page was known to be a bit inconsistent even at excellent/great shows. First Eddie said Jimmy played like he had broken fingers. Although around the same time EVH did mention Zep l and Zep ll were great albums. Later on as I said Eddie did praise

Page as a visionary if a bit erratic technically. Also, it's rock solid that no one except Millard ever heard the 6/21/77 show before

the "official release" in 83'-84' ? Of course Millard is the man, but you're talking underground and bootleg stuff. I'm sure some

bootleg fans don't even realize that in Zep's time the original sources for shows were small tape recorders, ?? small reel to reels ??, a few boards, and taping a vinyl boot !!!( possible EQ tweaks, fake stereo, noise reduction, blah, blah.). So when was "Destroyer"(the 27th, a weak show) officially released ? I saw it in a few record stores and flea markets, 4-disc vinyl set. Strider by the way made some excellent points, some of these shows were circulating not that much later than the shows themselves.

"Destroyer" (the April 27, '77 Cleveland soundboard) was out in the shops by the summer of 1977. Yes...it was that quick. 

[the chase]

12 hours ago, Strider said:

"Destroyer" (the April 27, '77 Cleveland soundboard) was out in the shops by the summer of 1977. Yes...it was that quick. 

yep .. I bought mine in the summer of 77.. maybe a little later.  

The irony is that there are plenty of times Eddie Van Halen hasn't sounded all that great live either, like he had a broken hand... It happens, they're human.

Drugs and Drink can make the all time greats sound not so good.

The main problem is his big mouth.

 

Edited November 14, 2018 by the chase