Dzldoc Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Getting some tangerine squeezings.... Just two months left in a dry year. Longest draught since I was 16yo, hell oranges will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Hartman Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Just two months left in a dry year. Longest draught since I was 16yo, hell oranges will do. Yeah. The draughts hurting everyone. Maybe we should all move to a small tropical island and call it "Paradise." I like tangerines, mangos, and pineapples. We will use the coconuts for a bowling alley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock Action Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 I see this pic I brought in a while back is the gift that keeps on giving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yahyoubetcha Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 I'm gonna say that every religion deals with this differently. I can only speak for the Catholic faith, and even then, there are multiple opinions within it. It goes something like this: If God made it that easy, then there would be no point in believing in God. Believing is itself the hard part! It's kind of like the "why is there evil in the world?" question. Without evil and without suffering, there would be no good and no learning experiences/pleasure. Perhaps most importantly,without evil, there is no free will. Your afterlife has similar yin and yang aspects to it too. If salvation in an afterlife was easily attainable, then free will wouldn't exist. We'd all be robots. It'd be very dull and very uninteresting. To be truly free, is to be in a prison. ... As far as your fairy-tale mascot assertions, it can go the other way too---Why be an atheist just because there is no proof that God doesn't exist? Which is why I think it's in your interest to play the odds and pick a religion. Where do you start? Hard to say. So to follow that logic, Santa, the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy DO exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 No not all. It's that kind of "logic" that doesn't help solve anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yahyoubetcha Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 No not all. It's that kind of "logic" that doesn't help solve anything. What are we trying to solve? It's just a discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 What are we trying to solve? It's just a discussion. Perhaps solve is the wrong word. But it's that kind of flat-out dismissive thinking that doesn't allow one to view all sides of an argument with at least some form of biasness or utter-disbelief of the other side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~tangerine~ Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 That would be because I'm a Libertarian stuck with a conservative and a liberal party. Where have you been? I thought most of us knew that by now I already voted for Bob Barr via absentee ballot... And Obama has voted with his party 97% of the time (or something high like that, I forget exact numbers) and since I hate the Democratic Party, that's a massive negative right there My Uncle Bill never even went to school after high school and he's one of the most intelligent men I've ever talked to about history, specifically in the fields of World War II, the (American) Civil War, and the Napoleonic era. My dad didn't go to college until he was around 27 and he only got a bachelor's degree after because he only went for two years. But he does things with computer programming that many of us can only dream of doing. I couldn't care less about education that happened 20, 30, or even 50 years ago. Education does not measure intelligence. I see it first hand every day. That's perfectly fine and it is your right. My problrm is that we're so used to this two party system, we forget about the many other parties out there, each with their own ideas. This has become so engrained into our mindset that peopel can't accept anything outside of "liberal" or "conservative" and to me, that's abhorrent. I voted mainly Libertarian with a sprinkling of Repub. and Dem. members in the government this year. I encourage anyone who is sick of the way this country has been run for the last century to vote third party, be it Green or Constitution or (especially!) Libertarian. Must seriously now, the two parties have torn us apart and we're facing the consequences now. Well at least you voted, that you can feel good about. I can't wait to vote. I have no problem with Obama voting most of the time with the party i support. This election has shown me the same mean spirited Republican tricks are still in action. Big disappointment to me. I believe Obama would have given a very fair fight if he was given one, but he wasn't. I don't want to be misunderstood on my feelings about Intelligence and Education. I KNOW that people are intelligent, imo, inherently. I know many people who are not college educated who are very smart. My point about McCain is that he is an "underachiever" intellectually. That is my honest feeling on him. His Educational record just shows me he was either a big goof off in school, or not very bright. Either way, i feel Politians, since they have so much power, should at least be "smart". I have a right to judge McCains Educational record because he is trying to run my country. It makes a difference to me. I agree that the two party systems isn't working well for our country in this day and age. I think it would be nice to have a mix of all the parties, but that is probably impossible. I also feel that any vote that isn't Dem or Repub won't make a difference in getting that party elected, so while you should absolutely vote for who you want to....we all know the Libs/Green party etc... will never get even close. It's a lost vote imo. But voting is a good feeling and everyone of age should exercise this very important right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 Well at least you voted, that you can feel good about. I can't wait to vote. I have no problem with Obama voting most of the time with the party i support. This election has shown me the same mean spirited Republican tricks are still in action. Big disappointment to me. I believe Obama would have given a very fair fight if he was given one, but he wasn't. Oh come on now. This is politics. His campaign's going to play dirty. Simple as that I don't want to be misunderstood on my feelings about Intelligence and Education. I KNOW that people are intelligent, imo, inherently. I know many people who are not college educated who are very smart. My point about McCain is that he is an "underachiever" intellectually. That is my honest feeling on him. His Educational record just shows me he was either a big goof off in school, or not very bright. Either way, i feel Politians, since they have so much power, should at least be "smart". I have a right to judge McCains Educational record because he is trying to run my country. It makes a difference to me.He may have been an 'underacheiver' 50 years ago but surely by now the man can be considered smart at least. I mean he's only served in the Senate for a while and been involved in politics forever. Why does his class average mean anything right now? Should the Baseball Hall of Fame look at a pro players high school stats? Enducation does not determine intelligence. I know kids that slept throgh high school and got 2.3 gpa...pretty low yes? But they got a 30 on their ACT. That's awesome! But they were low in the gpa class average. Would you consider that kid "smart" or would you say he's stupid for not acheiving high grades? I agree that the two party systems isn't working well for our country in this day and age. I think it would be nice to have a mix of all the parties, but that is probably impossible. Ross Perot did it not 20 years ago... I also feel that any vote that isn't Dem or Repub won't make a difference in getting that party elected, so while you should absolutely vote for who you want to....we all know the Libs/Green party etc... will never get even close. It's a lost vote imo. But voting is a good feeling and everyone of age should exercise this very important right. Lost vote? Any non-Democrat vote in my state is lost! Michigan is going Democrat, not even up for debate. A vote for McCain by my part is just as useless as a vote for Barr. At least this adds to the Libertarians total vote count and they're garnering more momentum.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shnflacwav Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 My point about McCain is that he is an "underachiever" intellectually. That is my honest feeling on him. His Educational record just shows me he was either a big goof off in school, or not very bright. Grades do not make a leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 For what its worth, Dwight Eisenhower barely got into West Point and was an average student at best Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~tangerine~ Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 Grades do not make a leader. True, leadership skills do. McCain is no leader. He is a flip flopping, temper tantrum throwing, Bush loving old man. And Sarah made the same mistake again today (that she has made so many times, lol)....quote " in a Palin/McCain Administration". As many are saying, yeah Sarah, the man "is" still breathing. http://nearing.newsvine.com/_news/2008/10/...-this-albatross McCain aides privately call Palin a 'total disaster' and 'this albatross' News Type: Event — Seeded on Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:33 PM EDT Article Source: Think Progress us-news Seeded by nearing On Salon Radio this morning, Glenn Greenwald asked Harper’s Scott Horton about his recent reporting on how Weekly Standard Editor Bill Kristol lobbied the McCain campaign to select Gov. Sarah Palin (R-AK) as the Republican vice presidential nominee. Horton explained that the McCain campaign is now regretting following Kristol’s advice, calling the Palin pick a “total disaster“: HORTON: We’ve got a lot of finger-pointing going on within the camp, and I’d say there’s a pretty broad agreement amongst a number of the senior-most advisors to McCain that the Palin pick is worse than disappointing. It’s a total disaster, as one describes to me. And there is a sort of blame game going on there. […] I would say the anger and irritation between a number of the senior people in the McCain camp and Bill Kristol is become really acute. … They view this man as the guy who gave them this albatross, Sarah Palin. I think there’s a lot of real anger about it. There’s also recognition that it’s too late to do anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~tangerine~ Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 For what its worth, Dwight Eisenhower barely got into West Point and was an average student at best John McCain is no Eisenhower. I think comparing the two is an insult to Dwight. Although he was President quite a few years before i was born, i know i felt the impact of his accomplishments. Eisenhower seemed to have a true desire for "peace". I don't see McCain as a peaceful man in any way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 John McCain is no Eisenhower. I think comparing the two is an insult to Dwight. Although he was President quite a few years before i was born, i know i felt the impact of his accomplishments. Eisenhower seemed to have a true desire for "peace". I don't see McCain as a peaceful man in any way. Eisenhower sent 5,000 Allied soldiers to their deaths and McCain doesn't seem peaceful? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L 7 Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 John McCain flattened plenty of "Bush" from his A-4. The only "Bush" Obama ever saw was between Michelle`s legs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shnflacwav Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 True, leadership skills do. McCain is no leader. He is a flip flopping, temper tantrum throwing, Bush loving old man. And Sarah made the same mistake again today (that she has made so many times, lol)....quote " in a Palin/McCain Administration". As many are saying, yeah Sarah, the man "is" still breathing. Well, I won't argue about Sarah Palin. I think she is a poor choice for VP, but more for other reasons than what she has been criticized for her by some people. Nor was my comment about her. I hardly think McCain is a Bush lover, and frankly, I want a President who shows a little emotion, even if it is pissed off. I hardly think a US Senator who has been in office for nearly 4 years with almost 2 of it spent running for President can be described as a great leader. What has he led? Let's see, he is the Chairman of United States Senate Foreign Relations Subcommittee on European Affairs, but they have not met since his appointment. So, what experience does he have to make him a better leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 Well his credentials aren't great, but Obama is certainly a charismatic leader, so I wouldn't knock him there. He can certainly rally people.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~tangerine~ Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 Eisenhower sent 5,000 Allied soldiers to their deaths and McCain doesn't seem peaceful? How many have we lost now under Bush's War (that McCain has always supported)? How many wounded? Too many...and counting. Haven't you heard McCain's desire to bomb Iran? McPeace? I don't think so http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAzBxFaio1I Eisenhower was fighting to end WWII, obtained a truce with Korea, and spent a good deal of his Presidency trying to make peace during the Cold War. He had a very accomplished military career, and i don't see McCain having one tenth of his brillance. Enough said, because i won't change my mind about McCain being an idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 I never said I supported the war, and just so ya know I am a strong supporter of Ike, great man he was. But my point earlier was to show that the correlation between grades and leadership/intelligence...which is almost nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shnflacwav Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 Well his credentials aren't great, but Obama is certainly a charismatic leader, so I wouldn't knock him there. He can certainly rally people.. Charismatic leader - no. Eloquent speaker - yes. Besides, when the issues that face America are a "result of the other party" then it's easier to rally people. When Reagan was elected, what were the issues facing Americans as a result of the other party - the economy and Carter was seen as weak on terrorism/defense due to the Iran hostage situation. Reagan was a great speaker, and also perceived by many as not being too smart. But when the other side is seen as the failure, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 Besides, when the issues that face America are a "result of the other party" then it's easier to rally people. When Reagan was elected, what were the issues facing Americans as a result of the other party - the economy and Carter was seen as weak on terrorism/defense due to the Iran hostage situation. Reagan was a great speaker, and also perceived by many as not being too smart. But when the other side is seen as the failure, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. Thats true to an extent. Afterall, more people "voted against Carter" than actually "voted for Reagan". That being said, if that was all true, McCain would be losing by about 20% by now. Charismatic leader - no. Eloquent speaker - yes.Meh, I disagree. He's an eloquent speaker but he's also charismatic. He's enticing, not just when he talks, but he seems like an everyman to many people, and he'll win based on that. I, however, disagree with those notions and hate what he stands for, but even i admit that he's captivating at times Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Hartman Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 True, leadership skills do. McCain is no leader. He is a flip flopping, temper tantrum throwing, Bush loving old man. And Sarah made the same mistake again today (that she has made so many times, lol)....quote " in a Palin/McCain Administration". As many are saying, yeah Sarah, the man "is" still breathing. http://nearing.newsvine.com/_news/2008/10/...-this-albatross McCain aides privately call Palin a 'total disaster' and 'this albatross' News Type: Event — Seeded on Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:33 PM EDT Article Source: Think Progress us-news Seeded by nearing On Salon Radio this morning, Glenn Greenwald asked Harper's Scott Horton about his recent reporting on how Weekly Standard Editor Bill Kristol lobbied the McCain campaign to select Gov. Sarah Palin (R-AK) as the Republican vice presidential nominee. Horton explained that the McCain campaign is now regretting following Kristol's advice, calling the Palin pick a "total disaster": HORTON: We've got a lot of finger-pointing going on within the camp, and I'd say there's a pretty broad agreement amongst a number of the senior-most advisors to McCain that the Palin pick is worse than disappointing. It's a total disaster, as one describes to me. And there is a sort of blame game going on there. […] I would say the anger and irritation between a number of the senior people in the McCain camp and Bill Kristol is become really acute. … They view this man as the guy who gave them this albatross, Sarah Palin. I think there's a lot of real anger about it. There's also recognition that it's too late to do anything. Do we serve white or red? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 Your Sarah Palin pics are beginning to rival THE FIRST LEDZEP's posts.... Just some food for thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Hartman Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 I never said I supported the war, and just so ya know I am a strong supporter of Ike, great man he was. But my point earlier was to show that the correlation between grades and leadership/intelligence...which is almost nothing. Oh please, you cannot even get in to places like West Point with bad grades, so don't even go there. To get the best paying job you have to take a test and answer leadership questions on your application. When your picked for a game, do they pick the stupid ass in the corner that cannot pronounce nuclear. NOT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shnflacwav Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 I, however, disagree with those notions and hate what he stands for, but even i admit that he's captivating at times I accept and respect your opinion as far as disagreeing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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