manderlyh Posted December 27, 2007 Share Posted December 27, 2007 That is the stuff that I have to study because I don't remember any of it! You have to study it really thoroughly when you're teaching it! I'm not good at English. When will I ever need to know how to tell a PN from a PA? I don't know. I don't know what a PN is or a PA is... Predicate nominatives and predicate adjectives. They're kind of like direct objects and indirect objects. wow I've never seen that! I know (kind of) what a nominative is...but I just learned that modern English doesn't have nominatives...Old English does. At least that's why my linguistics teacher said.. My English teacher is an old english teacher. One of our worksheets talked about the recent break up of the Beatles. A PA describes some and a PN can replace the subject. They sound easy but they're hard to indentify. I mean Old English as in OLD ENGLISH...Old English, Middle English, modern English.. Then maybe he teaches middle english. He teaches a lot of stuff that no one uses anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lzfan715 Posted December 27, 2007 Share Posted December 27, 2007 Now I can say I'm studying and be on here at the same time! This thread is a great idea. First place I'll come when I have English homework. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manderlyh Posted December 27, 2007 Author Share Posted December 27, 2007 Middle English ended in 1550. Your teacher teaches Modern English. Middle English is what form of English Chaucer and Shakespeare wrote in. Then I wonder why he teaches nominatives. See, this is why I don't like English, it's just too confusing. We still have nominatives (subject of sentence), we just don't tend to analyze English grammar using that term (or dative, accusative, genitive, etc.)--you see it more with Latin, Greek and German instruction, but rarely even French or Spanish. Also, Shakespeare (first play ca. 1580s, last ones ca. 1611) wrote in modern English. Well, I'm good at modern English, I normally speak with a blend of American English influence though. Which is missing some words in order to make the same meaning, for example: Mod Eng - "Do you love her a lot?" USA Eng - "You love her a lot?" It's mainly due to the fact that I've had an American girlfriend to influence me for nearly 3 years. But I understand what you're saying Alison. I know some Olde English too. Since we're on my least favorite subject that I am forced to teach. I'll add my $.02. English is a constantly evolving language. Now that is an aspect which I find interesting. Since I am relegated to teaching this with an English content teacher, I can focus on the trivial and meaningless details. Such as Bonham's example of blending his Mod Eng with the USA Eng. I prefer to analyze and abbreviate as much as I is allowable with these new mediums of texting, emailing and online chatting. I would reduce: Mod Eng - "Do you love her a lot?" USA Eng - "You love her a lot?" To Luv her a lot? This is acceptable because the You and Do are implied. In addition the Love is shortened to a debased form of the verancular. C dat English can be phun. I don't short hand things unless I'm texting. I just hate learning all the English stuff, I mean I can speak it so why does it matter if I diagram a sentence. They need to make kids read more. I am a freshman and I go to school with kids who are really smart but they're illiterate. I was heartbroken! SPATS--- your = possessive pronoun you're = you are the apostrophe shows that the "A" is missing. help? ALISON- Thanks for the clarification on the whole nominative thing. Very technical grammar makes me go Yes it helps. Thank you. I had no idea what most of it meant either until I took Latin and German in grad school. I learned Anglo-Saxon in undergrad, but mostly because I had a strangely innate feel for it and by much good guessing (my prof was rather puzzled, I think, when I got As on all the tests, but clearly had only the vaguest grasp of what 'preterite' meant ). Anyway, what a wonderful conversation you have here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonham Posted December 27, 2007 Share Posted December 27, 2007 That's a whole lotta English! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manderlyh Posted December 27, 2007 Author Share Posted December 27, 2007 I was wondering when you'd pop your head in and see it. Well, English is the most commonly used language used on this forum. Great conversation indeed. I think we should start a new thread. You know, I'm taking an exam in the middle of January, from nouns and verbs. Such a thread could be pretty useful, I could revise and post here at the same time.... Perhaps we should start a "Cunning Linguists" thread? About language only, of course. I think we should start an English thread. Mandy, you can be in charge and get some teaching practice. Okay...I'm off to work. I started the thread. Now it's everyone else's responsibility to give me something interesting to read when I get home. Hopefully some of our English professors will pop their heads in and contribute... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
59LesPaul Posted December 27, 2007 Share Posted December 27, 2007 Shit. I thought this thread was going to be about something else! (C'mon someone had to say it....) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lzfan715 Posted December 27, 2007 Share Posted December 27, 2007 Who are the English professors? I think Aqua is a teacher, I just don't know what kind. Oh, a noun is a person, place, thing, or idea. An adjective describes a noun. Like blonde and curly describes Robert's hair. So in sentence form you could say Robert has blonde, curly hair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yahyoubetcha Posted December 27, 2007 Share Posted December 27, 2007 Was it Ian Gillan who first used the phrase 'cunning linguist'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermit Posted December 27, 2007 Share Posted December 27, 2007 . Twat did you say? I cunt hear you; I've got an ear infuckion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheZeppyWanderer Posted December 27, 2007 Share Posted December 27, 2007 Was it Ian Gillan who first used the phrase 'cunning linguist'? ...... " a master of many tongues " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manderlyh Posted December 28, 2007 Author Share Posted December 28, 2007 Hey! This is supposed to be a REAL language thread! :shakesfist: Don't screw with me today---I've had a BAD day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Tripper Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 ILOVEGRAMMAR. I always made 100s on my grammar tests in high school because I'm such a grammar freak. My mom taught English and I'm better at grammar than she is. Hahaha. Obviously I don't always speak or type properly, but still... I know the rules, dammit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manderlyh Posted December 28, 2007 Author Share Posted December 28, 2007 ^then are you going to help me out, DayTripper? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leddy Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 Was it Ian Gillan who first used the phrase 'cunning linguist'? Knocking at Your back Door from Perfect Strangers 1985 !!! "She eases form her Austin to her Bently " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katuschka Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 Hey! This is supposed to be a REAL language thread! Right! This ain't no place for childish pervs. Do you know what time is it now? It's...POETRY TIME! The Battle of Brunnanburh Her Æþelstan cyning, eorla dryhten, beorna beahgifa and his broþor eac, Eadmund æþeling, ealdorlangne tir geslogon æt sæcce sweorda ecgum ymbe Brunnanburh. Bordweal clufan, heowan heaþolinde hamora lafan afaran Eadweardes, swa him geæþele wæs from cneomægum, þæt hi æt campe oft wiþ laþra gehwæne land ealgodon hord and hamas. Hettend crungun, Sceotta leoda and scipflotan fæge feollan. Feld dænnede secga swate siðþan sunne up on morgentid, mære tungol glad ofer grundas godes condel beorht, eces drihtnes, oð sio æþele gesceaft sah to setle. þær læg secg mænig garum ageted, guma norþerna ofer scild scoten, swilce Scittisc eac, werig wiges sæd. Wesseaxe forð ondlongne dæg eorodcistum on last legdun laþum þeodum, heowan herefleman hindan þearle mecum mylenscearpan. Myrce ne wyrndon heardes hondplegan hæleþa nanum þæ mid Anlafe ofer æra gebland on lides bosme land gesohtun fæge to gefeohte. Fife lægun on þam campstede ciningas giunge sweordum aswefede, swilce seofene eac eorlas Anlafes, unrim heriges flotan and Sceotta. þær geflemed wearð Norðmanna bregu, nede gebeded to lides stefne litle weorode. Cread cnear on flot; cyning ut gewat on fealene flod, feorh generede. Swilce þær eac se froda mid fleame com on his cyþþe norð Costontinus; har hildering hreman ne þorfte mecea gemanan; he wæs his mæga sceard, freonda gefylled on folcstede, beslagen æt sæcce, and his sunu forlet on wælstowe wundun forgrunden giungne æt guðe. Gelpan ne þorfte beorn blandenfeax bilgeslehtes eald inwidda, ne Anlaf þy ma; mid heora herelafum hlehhan ne þorftun þæt heo beaduweorca beteran wurdun on campstede, cumbolgehnastes, garmittinge, gumena gemotes, wæpengewrixles, þæs hi on wælfelda wiþ Eadweardes afaran plegodan. Gewitan him þa Norþmen nægledcnearrum, dreorig daraða laf on Dinges mere, ofer deop wæter Difelin secan, and eft Iraland æwiscmode. Swilce þa gebroþer begen ætsamne, cyning and æþeling cyþþe sohton Wesseaxena land wiges hremige. Letan him behindan hræw bryttian saluwigpadan, þone sweartan hræfn, hyrnednebban, and þane hasewanpadan, earn æftan hwit æses brucan, grædigne guðhafoc and þæt græge deor, wulf on wealde. Ne wearð wæl mare on þis eiglande æfre gieta folces gefylled beforan þissum sweordes ecgum, þæs þe us secgað bec, ealde uðwitan, siþþan eastan hider Engle and Seaxe up becoman, ofer brad brimu Brytene sohtan, wlance wigsmiþas Wealas ofercoman, eorlas arhwate eard begeatan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leddy Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 Right! This ain't no place for childish pervs. Do you know what time is it now? It's...POETRY TIME! The Battle of Brunnanburh Her Æþelstan cyning, eorla dryhten, beorna beahgifa and his broþor eac, Eadmund æþeling, ealdorlangne tir geslogon æt sæcce sweorda ecgum ymbe Brunnanburh. Bordweal clufan, heowan heaþolinde hamora lafan afaran Eadweardes, swa him geæþele wæs from cneomægum, þæt hi æt campe oft wiþ laþra gehwæne land ealgodon hord and hamas. Hettend crungun, Sceotta leoda and scipflotan fæge feollan. Feld dænnede secga swate siðþan sunne up on morgentid, mære tungol glad ofer grundas godes condel beorht, eces drihtnes, oð sio æþele gesceaft sah to setle. þær læg secg mænig garum ageted, guma norþerna ofer scild scoten, swilce Scittisc eac, werig wiges sæd. Wesseaxe forð ondlongne dæg eorodcistum on last legdun laþum þeodum, heowan herefleman hindan þearle mecum mylenscearpan. Myrce ne wyrndon heardes hondplegan hæleþa nanum þæ mid Anlafe ofer æra gebland on lides bosme land gesohtun fæge to gefeohte. Fife lægun on þam campstede ciningas giunge sweordum aswefede, swilce seofene eac eorlas Anlafes, unrim heriges flotan and Sceotta. þær geflemed wearð Norðmanna bregu, nede gebeded to lides stefne litle weorode. Cread cnear on flot; cyning ut gewat on fealene flod, feorh generede. Swilce þær eac se froda mid fleame com on his cyþþe norð Costontinus; har hildering hreman ne þorfte mecea gemanan; he wæs his mæga sceard, freonda gefylled on folcstede, beslagen æt sæcce, and his sunu forlet on wælstowe wundun forgrunden giungne æt guðe. Gelpan ne þorfte beorn blandenfeax bilgeslehtes eald inwidda, ne Anlaf þy ma; mid heora herelafum hlehhan ne þorftun þæt heo beaduweorca beteran wurdun on campstede, cumbolgehnastes, garmittinge, gumena gemotes, wæpengewrixles, þæs hi on wælfelda wiþ Eadweardes afaran plegodan. Gewitan him þa Norþmen nægledcnearrum, dreorig daraða laf on Dinges mere, ofer deop wæter Difelin secan, and eft Iraland æwiscmode. Swilce þa gebroþer begen ætsamne, cyning and æþeling cyþþe sohton Wesseaxena land wiges hremige. Letan him behindan hræw bryttian saluwigpadan, þone sweartan hræfn, hyrnednebban, and þane hasewanpadan, earn æftan hwit æses brucan, grædigne guðhafoc and þæt græge deor, wulf on wealde. Ne wearð wæl mare on þis eiglande æfre gieta folces gefylled beforan þissum sweordes ecgum, þæs þe us secgað bec, ealde uðwitan, siþþan eastan hider Engle and Seaxe up becoman, ofer brad brimu Brytene sohtan, wlance wigsmiþas Wealas ofercoman, eorlas arhwate eard begeatan Not Childish just a perv thankyou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redeyedrichard Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 I studied English Language and English Literature extensively for two years. I studied language acquisition as well as the evolution of the english language. I delved into the works of Chaucer and other old English texts. It was great fun. Also studied dialects and the effect the language has on people. We should have a create a neologism competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leddy Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 I studied English Language and English Literature extensively for two years. I studied language acquisition as well as the evolution of the english language. I delved into the works of Chaucer and other old English texts. It was great fun. Also studied dialects and the effect the language has on people. We should have a create a neologism competition. I always think how cool it is that in a small country like ours that I can travel 30 miles down the road and people sound totally different to me !! Do they not say that the Bristol accent is derived from the West Indies ?? as there is a connection with the tone/sound as alot of people came over from the Carribean to Bristol many moons ago ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redeyedrichard Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 I always think how cool it is that in a small country like ours that I can travel 30 miles down the road and people sound totally different to me !! Do they not say that the Bristol accent is derived from the West Indies ?? as there is a connection with the tone/sound as alot of people came over from the Carribean to Bristol many moons ago ! Yeah, I seem to recall something like that. We also studied how we conclude things from certain accents....we looked at a report of employment. Employers are more reluctant to employ someone with a certain accent. It was a proper study as well. And yeah I know what you mean, there is so much diversity in dialect in this country. Even in the area where you live, you can find so many different dialects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryboru Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 Sorry Off Topic but where did you get that picture of Janis on the motorcycle is awesome barryboru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manderlyh Posted December 28, 2007 Author Share Posted December 28, 2007 Right! This ain't no place for childish pervs. Do you know what time is it now? It's...POETRY TIME! Crap, Kat. You have IPA symbols that I don't know in there! I only know the sounds that are in American English. :'( ETA: POETRY TIME! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katuschka Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 Crap, Kat. You have IPA symbols that I don't know in there! I only know the sounds that are in American English. :'( ETA: POETRY TIME! That's because those are not IPA symbols. The "poem" is in Old English. Some of the old germanic letters were later used for the IPA system, because they actually correspond (or should correspont, because the speech sounds are hardly the same now as they were before) with the pronounced speech sounds. Not all of them have been used though. That's probably why you don't know them. For example this one: þ It's phonemic equivalent is θ. There was even a tendency to use þ for this sound, and make it therefore one on the IPA symbols, but it was agreed that θ is a more convenient symbol, because it looks like a graphic scheme of the speech organs in the position of making this sound, which makes it easier to remember. I used to have the whole IPA installed, but after I had finished my seminar work, I deleted it. I still have it on CD-rom somewhere.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAG Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 SORRY JAG, NO TANG FOR YOU!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manderlyh Posted December 28, 2007 Author Share Posted December 28, 2007 JAG! That was totally taken outta context! I had to think for a long time to remember where that came from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAG Posted December 28, 2007 Share Posted December 28, 2007 That was totally taken outta context! ... oh, I dunno about that. I think this is an perfectly apt thread to re-quote you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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