Is chivalry dead?

[slave to zep]

So I am in the Doctors waiting room, and a woman, man and child walk through. The woman is about 8 months pregnant, carrying a toddler, her handbag and a large baby bag.

The man is carrying a piece of paper ........

What's wrong with this picture ?

I wanted to smack him in the face......

[IpMan]

Yes, pretty much unfortunately. I am very old school, I believe in manners, honor, and being polite. When I go to a restaurant for example and I sit down to wait, if a woman comes in I always give up my seat. I hold doors for people. I say hello, good day, how are you, and show genuine concern and empathy for my fellow human beings.

Too bad most people do not. I feel the rise of social media and technology have done the exact opposite of aiding people in social behavior. Instead we have become a society of Kardashians', narcissistic to the extreme. Tweeting about every shit we take, every bite we eat as if we were the second coming of Christ. I see the elderly with their noses jammed into their smartphones, posting about how awesome their grand kids are yet never taking the time to experience the world directly in front of them. Kids with zero social skills because who needs those on-line.

Manners and chivalry were the first casualties of the digital age and we have moved toward lack of basic social skills. I tell you this my friends, if you want to know what the next wealth generating profession will be it will be this: Social liaison of any sort, that's what.

[jimmie ray]

^All true, I guess it's not taught or demonstrated too much, anymore. Yet, I see at the college I work at, so much public hugging between the sexes (just random people, not couples). It seems so odd, since they probably see each other continuously throughout the day. They'll hug, but then walk through a door and not even glance to see if someone is walking behind them, that they could hold the door for.

[Badgeholder Still]

Yes, pretty much unfortunately. I am very old school, I believe in manners, honor, and being polite. When I go to a restaurant for example and I sit down to wait, if a woman comes in I always give up my seat. I hold doors for people. I say hello, good day, how are you, and show genuine concern and empathy for my fellow human beings.

Too bad most people do not. I feel the rise of social media and technology have done the exact opposite of aiding people in social behavior. Instead we have become a society of Kardashians', narcissistic to the extreme. Tweeting about every shit we take, every bite we eat as if we were the second coming of Christ. I see the elderly with their noses jammed into their smartphones, posting about how awesome their grand kids are yet never taking the time to experience the world directly in front of them. Kids with zero social skills because who needs those on-line.

Manners and chivalry were the first casualties of the digital age and we have moved toward lack of basic social skills. I tell you this my friends, if you want to know what the next wealth generating profession will be it will be this: Social liaison of any sort, that's what.

Too bad you don't believe in humility. It's a nice trait. Are you sure you're not the second coming of Christ? Having empathy for your fellow human being means when seeing someone having a weak moment, with a smartphone or otherwise, you don't judge and define that person by what you may see in a brief single space in time. And when someone does earn the title of Asshole, you might consider that they just have another viewpoint in the infinite spectrum of perspective. That would be a thoughtful, "liberal" point of view.

Chivalry didn't die with the invention of the the printing press, the telegraph, the telephone, the television, the computer, or the smartphone. It isn't something that has ever been a standard or a constant. It still exists as assholes have always existed and always will. Take it from me, i'm a noted authority on the subject.

Is this woman really a sympathetic figure? Sounds like she married and had two kids with him. If she chooses to suffer this guy that's her business. Maybe she married him for his money and is reaping some karma. Maybe you only got a glimpse of what their relationship is all about.

[slave to zep]

Too bad you don't believe in humility. It's a nice trait. Are you sure you're not the second coming of Christ? Having empathy for your fellow human being means when seeing someone having a weak moment, with a smartphone or otherwise, you don't judge and define that person by what you may see in a brief single space in time. And when someone does earn the title of Asshole, you might consider that they just have another viewpoint in the infinite spectrum of perspective. That would be a thoughtful, "liberal" point of view.

Chivalry didn't die with the invention of the the printing press, the telegraph, the telephone, the television, the computer, or the smartphone. It isn't something that has ever been a standard or a constant. It still exists as assholes have always existed and always will. Take it from me, i'm a noted authority on the subject.

Is this woman really a sympathetic figure? Sounds like she married and had two kids with him. If she chooses to suffer this guy that's her business. Maybe she married him for his money and is reaping some karma. Maybe you only got a glimpse of what their relationship is all about.

hmmm...........

I don't care what the reason was that that she married him. She was 8 months pregnant, carrying a child, and a handbag, and a baby bag. COME ON!!! My husband would no sooner stand by and let ANY woman do that while he was there! whether it be me, his Mum, sister, a stranger..... Because he is a GENTLEMAN.

Let me tell you I work in retail and I see it all the time.

That man was being a totally inconsiderate bastard AT THAT MOMENT......

[Badgeholder Still]

hmmm...........

I don't care what the reason was that that she married him. She was 8 months pregnant, carrying a child, and a handbag, and a baby bag. COME ON!!! My husband would no sooner stand by and let ANY woman do that while he was there! whether it be me, his Mum, sister, a stranger..... Because he is a GENTLEMAN.

Let me tell you I work in retail and I see it all the time.

That man was being a totally inconsiderate bastard AT THAT MOMENT......

As much as it's a man's responsibility to be a gentleman, it's a woman's responsibility to not settle for a thoughtless schmuck. Maybe there aren't enough good guys to go around. I don't know. Regardless it's a woman's responsibility to find a man who shows her respect.

And we're assuming this guy isn't a gentleman based on this brief moment. What do we know about the circumstances which led to this moment? Maybe he was recovering from back surgery. Do we have enough facts about this moment to question an entire gender and it's chivalrous activity? If it's simply what it appears to be, a thoughtless act, then sadly it's nothing new. I mean, did it really surprise you that, in the world we live in, a guy was being an inconsiderate bastard?

[SteveAJones]

This question does not come up in Japan because the Japanese are well renowned for being among the most polite people in the world. However, whenever I leave this island paradise for ANY destination elsewhere in the world I'm always reminded that there are still plenty of rude, self-absorbed and flat out inconsiderate people on this planet.

Personally, when elsewhere I do my best to uphold the high societal etiquette standards I've become accustomed to residing here, but it's downright aggravating to hold a door open for someone as a matter of common courtesy and have that gestured ignored, and even worse to get criticized for doing so by some self-righteous feminist. A recent study sheds light on this mentality:

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/03/11/polite-chivalrous-men-are-benevolent-sexists-and-may-not-even-know-it-claim-researchers/

Just say thank you...or even thanks...and move on.

[Sathington Willoughby]

This question does not come up in Japan because the Japanese are well renowned for being among the most polite people in the world. However, whenever I leave this island paradise for ANY destination elsewhere in the world I'm always reminded that there are still plenty of rude, self-absorbed and flat out inconsiderate people on this planet.

Do you own a mirror?

[IpMan]

Too bad you don't believe in humility. It's a nice trait. Are you sure you're not the second coming of Christ? Having empathy for your fellow human being means when seeing someone having a weak moment, with a smartphone or otherwise, you don't judge and define that person by what you may see in a brief single space in time. And when someone does earn the title of Asshole, you might consider that they just have another viewpoint in the infinite spectrum of perspective. That would be a thoughtful, "liberal" point of view.

Chivalry didn't die with the invention of the the printing press, the telegraph, the telephone, the television, the computer, or the smartphone. It isn't something that has ever been a standard or a constant. It still exists as assholes have always existed and always will. Take it from me, i'm a noted authority on the subject.

Is this woman really a sympathetic figure? Sounds like she married and had two kids with him. If she chooses to suffer this guy that's her business. Maybe she married him for his money and is reaping some karma. Maybe you only got a glimpse of what their relationship is all about.

Yes, I believe in humility, I also believe in observation and statistical analysis. Several studies have pointed out this trend as increasing exponentially since smartphones in particular came on the scene. A bad day or moment is one thing, a behavioral pattern is another...or maybe I hit a nerve.

[slave to zep]

As much as it's a man's responsibility to be a gentleman, it's a woman's responsibility to not settle for a thoughtless schmuck. Maybe there aren't enough good guys to go around. I don't know. Regardless it's a woman's responsibility to find a man who shows her respect.

And we're assuming this guy isn't a gentleman based on this brief moment. What do we know about the circumstances which led to this moment? Maybe he was recovering from back surgery. Do we have enough facts about this moment to question an entire gender and it's chivalrous activity? If it's simply what it appears to be, a thoughtless act, then sadly it's nothing new. I mean, did it really surprise you that, in the world we live in, a guy was being an inconsiderate bastard?

No, I'm sorry, as I said, my husband would NEVER stand by and let that happen, no matter what.

The guy in question was not walking with any kind of sign that he was ill or sore.

SHE, on the other hand was struggling with her loads. Bloody hell, as a man you don't know how hard it is just to walk, sit, stand from sitting when you are pregnant.....SHE should have been the one carrying only the paper FFS!

Every day when I get home from work, if my hubby is home, he will come to the car and open the gate for me. If I have any shopping etc he will grab it off me as I arrive.

If we go to a concert or such, he carries the back pack with our coats etc.....

Don't turn this into a sexist thing, because it isn't. This is about rudeness and lack of respect, and MANNERS!

[ScarletMacaw]

, it's a woman's responsibility to not settle for a thoughtless schmuck. Regardless it's a woman's responsibility to find a man who shows her respect.

Blaming the victim. Nothing new there!

[Disco Duck]

So I am in the Doctors waiting room, and a woman, man and child walk through. The woman is about 8 months pregnant, carrying a toddler, her handbag and a large baby bag.

The man is carrying a piece of paper ........

What's wrong with this picture ?

I wanted to smack him in the face......

Three thoughts occur to me right away:

1) Are you certain the man and woman were together?

2) Maybe the man has a back or shoulder injury that prevents his carrying the toddler or baby bag.

3) What type of doctors? If they're not OB/GYN's or pediatricians, how do you know the man wasn't the patient?

Is chivalry dead? I think it depends on how you define chivalry. I do think civility is in short supply in contemporary American society. I've observed too many basically decent people behave in an inconsiderate manner in public.

[Badgeholder Still]

, it's a woman's responsibility to not settle for a thoughtless schmuck. Regardless it's a woman's responsibility to find a man who shows her respect.

Blaming the victim. Nothing new there!

She's not a rape victim. She is, according to Slave to Zep, a woman who has made a bad choice finding a mate.. It's everyone's personal responsibility to be with someone who respects them and to kick them to the curb when they don't. I'm talking about female empowerment. Are you really comparing a rape to a thoughtless husband? This is about a choice which is hers to make. If he is emotionally or otherwise abusive, yes i think she should stop having kids with the guy and get away from him. That's her duty to herself and her kids. No one else can help her if she doesn't make that decision for herself.

And let me reiterate, we've only seen a glimpse of how their relationship works and through the eyes of a third party.

As for chivalry itself, that's a code which is literally from the dark ages and does conflict to a degree with modern feminist values and ideals. It also could be argued that the number of pure fair virgin maidens is, sadly, on the decline.

[apantherfrommd]

It's not only a privilege to walk in someone else's shoes, but it's also a responsibility. If a man isn't willing to walk that extra mile, he's either lazy, indifferent, apathetic, weak or a coward.

[SteveAJones]

It's not only a privilege to walk in someone else's shoes, but it's also a responsibility. If a man isn't willing to walk that extra mile, he's either lazy, indifferent, apathetic, weak or a coward.

Sometimes the woman he's with is a nagging bitch so he will just do the best he can to get through an already miserable situation.

[slave to zep]

, it's a woman's responsibility to not settle for a thoughtless schmuck. Regardless it's a woman's responsibility to find a man who shows her respect.

Blaming the victim. Nothing new there!

Can you believe these guys?

Three thoughts occur to me right away:

1) Are you certain the man and woman were together?

2) Maybe the man has a back or shoulder injury that prevents his carrying the toddler or baby bag.

3) What type of doctors? If they're not OB/GYN's or pediatricians, how do you know the man wasn't the patient?

Is chivalry dead? I think it depends on how you define chivalry. I do think civility is in short supply in contemporary American society. I've observed too many basically decent people behave in an inconsiderate manner in public.

1 : YES they were a couple!

2 : NO he was walking normally, no bandages!

3 : Not everyone goes to OBGYN's here in OZ. The vast majority of women see regular GP's for pregnancy.

There is a lot of thoughtless people in this world, male and female, but chivalry on the part of men in general, is dying, IMHO.

She's not a rape victim. She is, according to Slave to Zep, a woman who has made a bad choice finding a mate.. It's everyone's personal responsibility to be with someone who respects them and to kick them to the curb when they don't. I'm talking about female empowerment. Are you really comparing a rape to a thoughtless husband? This is about a choice which is hers to make. If he is emotionally or otherwise abusive, yes i think she should stop having kids with the guy and get away from him. That's her duty to herself and her kids. No one else can help her if she doesn't make that decision for herself.

And let me reiterate, we've only seen a glimpse of how their relationship works and through the eyes of a third party.

As for chivalry itself, that's a code which is literally from the dark ages and does conflict to a degree with modern feminist values and ideals. It also could be argued that the number of pure fair virgin maidens is, sadly, on the decline.

Nobody called her a rape victim.

YES, he could well be a nice guy 99% of the time, but to stand by while a pregnant woman - a VERY pregnant woman, carried a toddler, a handbag and a baby carry bag, while he carried nothing, is not acceptable to me.

IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HIM BEING A MAN!

I would not let her carry anything but her handbag if I were with her!

She is ALREADY carrying a load - HELLO, the baby inside her is pushing on her internal organs, her back is screaming, and her feet are throbbing..... I know, I've had 3 babies.

again -

It's not only a privilege to walk in someone else's shoes, but it's also a responsibility. If a man isn't willing to walk that extra mile, he's either lazy, indifferent, apathetic, weak or a coward.

or insensitive / thoughtless.

Sometimes the woman he's with is a nagging bitch so he will just do the best he can to get through an already miserable situation.

true, but wait until that nagging bitch has had THEIR child at least.

She can't just not carry her load if her back is hurting....

again

[Badgeholder Still]

"IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HIM BEING A MAN!"

So this isn't about chivalry then, is it. Sorry, i was thrown by the thread's title.

It's starting to sound like it's about you and hubby's flawless character more than anything. Congratulations on being awesome.

Everyone everywhere should act thoughtfully and flawlessly in all situations.

Everyone should understand the experience of having three pregnancies.

I should have sympathy for women who humor, suffer, marry and procreate with inconsiderate bastards.

Pregnant women should never have to carry anything.

Fetuses press against internal organs.

Chivalry is dead.

Got it!

Thank you.

[slave to zep]

"IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HIM BEING A MAN!"

So this isn't about chivalry then, is it. Sorry, i was thrown by the thread's title.

It's starting to sound like it's about you and hubby's flawless character more than anything. Congratulations on being awesome.

Everyone everywhere should act thoughtfully and flawlessly in all situations.

Everyone should understand the experience of having three pregnancies.

I should have sympathy for women who humor, suffer, marry and procreate with inconsiderate bastards.

Pregnant women should never have to carry anything.

Fetuses press against internal organs.

Chivalry is dead.

Got it!

Thank you.

Oh dear, how childish you are.

Grow up.

I don't think I am awesome, far from it.

And my husband isn't flawless, but he does have lovely manners and is a very thoughtful person - to all, not just me.

you could learn a lot from him.

I guess it has to do with the way you are brought up......

I'm not here for a fight, and I really didn't think this topic would bring about this kind of response.

[Badgeholder Still]

What kind of response were you expecting? Do you need everyone to agree with everything you say? That's a healthy expectation.

You're just here to have everyone validate your thoughts. In the end i did that for you and it still wasn't enough.

And again with the husband. Oh boy.

And you brought my mother into it? Interesting way to rise above my level.

Where's the fight? I was almost having fun. Chill out for God's sake.

[slave to zep]

What kind of response were you expecting? Do you need everyone to agree with everything you say? That's a healthy expectation.

You're just here to have everyone validate your thoughts. In the end i did that for you and it still wasn't enough.

And again with the husband. Oh boy.

And you brought my mother into it? Interesting way to rise above my level.

Where's the fight? I was almost having fun. Chill out for God's sake.

I was hoping for rational discussions.

I felt like you were being a bit snarky towards me but perhaps I was mistaken.

I don't get why you seem iffended by my comments about my husband, I am just using his behaviour as an example.

Maybe we can start over? Cheers.

[ScarletMacaw]

." It also could be argued that the number of pure fair virgin maidens is, sadly, on the decline."

Another misogynist remark.

[osoz]

I guess we are running into the gender debate because of the word chivalry used in the title. It always relates to men's behaviour to women.

I would not be at all surprised to see the same happen here in the UK as described by the OP. It is normal, nobody would notice or care.

People have changed, male and female. I always get a shock returning to the UK from abroad. Many people are rude, self important and just plain ignorant these days and I will run into at the airport straightaway. Fortunately not everyone, so it is best to remember that and try to see the good in people.

[IpMan]

"IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HIM BEING A MAN!"

So this isn't about chivalry then, is it. Sorry, i was thrown by the thread's title.

It's starting to sound like it's about you and hubby's flawless character more than anything. Congratulations on being awesome.

Everyone everywhere should act thoughtfully and flawlessly in all situations.

Everyone should understand the experience of having three pregnancies.

I should have sympathy for women who humor, suffer, marry and procreate with inconsiderate bastards.

Pregnant women should never have to carry anything.

Fetuses press against internal organs.

Chivalry is dead.

Got it!

Thank you.

Dude, you must be the king of hyperbole, you take a simple question and twist it into something completely different and then get mad at the original poster?

The fact is many people out there today are lacking in manners, both men and women, however I do feel a man has a greater responsibility than a woman in certain regard, that is my opinion. Maybe if women were not treated as second-class citizens or even chattle for the majority of life on this planet I would feel differently. However you don't subjugate an entire group of people for thousands of years and then expect perfect equality, human nature does not work that way. Just sucks I guess that you were born in the age when centuries old wrongs need to be made right. As far as I am concerned it is a small price to pay for all the crap men have done to women.

Anyway, if you don't want to be chivalrous or conduct yourself with manners that is your right as a person, just don't expect people to be there for you should you need it happy man.

[chef free]

I don't know about everyone else but I ALWAYS hold the door, offer my seat, offer to carry heavy or awkward loads, remove my hat indoors or when I meet a woman, etc.

[slave to zep]

." It also could be argued that the number of pure fair virgin maidens is, sadly, on the decline."

Another misogynist remark.

I guess we are running into the gender debate because of the word chivalry used in the title. It always relates to men's behaviour to women.

I would not be at all surprised to see the same happen here in the UK as described by the OP. It is normal, nobody would notice or care.

People have changed, male and female. I always get a shock returning to the UK from abroad. Many people are rude, self important and just plain ignorant these days and I will run into at the airport straightaway. Fortunately not everyone, so it is best to remember that and try to see the good in people.

I really do feel that rudeness is on the incline, in the real world and cyber world!

Dude, you must be the king of hyperbole, you take a simple question and twist it into something completely different and then get mad at the original poster?

The fact is many people out there today are lacking in manners, both men and women, however I do feel a man has a greater responsibility than a woman in certain regard, that is my opinion. Maybe if women were not treated as second-class citizens or even chattle for the majority of life on this planet I would feel differently. However you don't subjugate an entire group of people for thousands of years and then expect perfect equality, human nature does not work that way. Just sucks I guess that you were born in the age when centuries old wrongs need to be made right. As far as I am concerned it is a small price to pay for all the crap men have done to women.

Anyway, if you don't want to be chivalrous or conduct yourself with manners that is your right as a person, just don't expect people to be there for you should you need it happy man.

Thank you, kind Sir

I don't know about everyone else but I ALWAYS hold the door, offer my seat, offer to carry heavy or awkward loads, remove my hat indoors or when I meet a woman, etc.

That is wonderful to hear.

So do I.