New box sets including unreleased material

[Melcórë]

Thanks to Kevin Shitley, the DVD is flooded with unnecessary cuts.

...Not really.

Yeah, and don't forget Dick Carruthers. He did pretty well on Albert Hall but the way he synced the Garden songs up is very unprofessional.

How so? He worked well with what he had, I thought...

[ledzepfilm]

Most of the footage is out of sync.

[newt]

i just joined the forum to find out about these boxsets.

thanks for all the info. great job by you guys.

god help the zeppelin newbies like me.

[SuperDave]

Welcome to the forum Newt! Hope you enjoy it here and post some good stuff!

[nirvana]

We can blame Carruthers, Shirley, Johns, or whatever engineer works with Jimmy on a re-re-re-release of Zeppelin material.

The absolute bottom line here is that the liner notes will always say: Produced by Jimmy Page or Re-edited and over-seen by Jimmy Page.

Jimmy Page hears the final edit and approves the product for release to the public. He signs off on the paycheck to the studio

engineers and thanks them for their efforts. The other members of the band also give their approvals to some extent.

If the finished product is considered by the general public or "Zeppelin experts" to be sub-standard - the engineers cannot be held responsible for the final say.

[Geezer]

Almost all of that is false. What Carruthers did with the MSG footage is shameful. Jimmy Page has nothing to do with it.

[nirvana]

Almost all of that is false. What Carruthers did with the MSG footage is shameful. Jimmy Page has nothing to do with it.

Footage maybe, but soundtrack or live concert editing is all on Jimmy.

[ledzepfilm]

Shirley did the audio editing. Jimmy oversaw the project and approved the quality.

When it comes to the footage:

RAH was great. The footage was (mostly) matched. The only let down to me is Whole Lotta Love. A lot of the out of sync footage matches the bootleg footage and it seems to me like they didn't care to fix it.

The Garden was terrible. Barely any footage was matched (there's only two matching shots in Black Dog) but the only good song was The Ocean. Since I've Been Loving You is probably the worst sync job I've ever seen.

Earls Court was a little better. It was a mix of the 24th and 25th. The two letdowns are the poor "8mm footage" made from the proshot and that a lot of the shots of Bonham are out of sync.

Knebworth was much better. It was a mix of the 4th and 11th but even if it was the 11th, the audio still matched the footage, mostly.

[nirvana]

^{I can't help but think the Band considers 1977 as an abomination to their legacy. Not much good came out during that Tour. In fact more poor shows, accidents, drug related incidents}

^{on and off stage, beatings, death, and carnage made the headlines than any other Tour prior to 1977.}

^{Everyone had lost control in the Band and during the live shows. Bootleg audio proves that despite the poor recording quality back then. Jimmy was a mess, Robert's voice was shot}

^{for the most part, Bonham was jacked, and JPJ was looking for a quick exit. Forget the management, they were captains of a sinking ship.}

^{Did Zep have some great shows in '77? Sure, but they were few and the poor ones were so bad that the good shows are now over-looked.}

^{Zeppelin died in 1975 as a great live band with consistently awesome shows for the most part. In later years, Knebworth and of course the O2, showed what a focused and straight Led Zep}

^{can do as a live act.}

^{No wonder Jimmy is hesitant to release any '77 live stuff.}

[ledzepfilm]

^ Very well said.

[nirvana]

For the record, as poor as some of the 1977 shows were, I would still rather have seen Led Zeppelin on a bad night

than ANY other band on their BEST night. And that's the truth.

[Geezer]

^{I can't help but think the Band considers 1977 as an abomination to their legacy. Not much good came out during that Tour. In fact more poor shows, accidents, drug related incidents}

^{on and off stage, beatings, death, and carnage made the headlines than any other Tour prior to 1977.}

^{Everyone had lost control in the Band and during the live shows. Bootleg audio proves that despite the poor recording quality back then. Jimmy was a mess, Robert's voice was shot}

^{for the most part, Bonham was jacked, and JPJ was looking for a quick exit. Forget the management, they were captains of a sinking ship.}

^{Did Zep have some great shows in '77? Sure, but they were few and the poor ones were so bad that the good shows are now over-looked.}

^{Zeppelin died in 1975 as a great live band with consistently awesome shows for the most part. In later years, Knebworth and of course the O2, showed what a focused and straight Led Zep}

^{can do as a live act.}

^{No wonder Jimmy is hesitant to release any '77 live stuff.}

I can't believe I'm reading this. The O2 concert can't touch even the worst '77 performances. And Knebworth was far from being focused.

[Geezer]

Since I've Been Loving You is probably the worst sync job I've ever seen.

I agree. This is arguably even worse. There's even a snippet of Heartbreaker midway through the guitar solo.

[nirvana]

I can't believe I'm reading this. The O2 concert can't touch even the worst '77 performances. And Knebworth was far from being focused.

Seriously? Have you heard some of the "bad" shows from '77? Some are totally un-listenable, from Robert's hoarse voice

to Jimmy's reckless and dis-jointed guitar playing, some of those nights were a disaster! Are you saying that Knebworth and the O2

were worse than those shows? You gotta be joking man!

[Geezer]

Was there anything really remarkable about the O2 concert? It was a huge event but it was not an exceptionally good performance.

[nirvana]

Was there anything really remarkable about the O2 concert? It was a huge event but it was not an exceptionally good performance.

Let's see...hmmm...For Your Life, In My Time of Dying, and Kashmir come to mind as being very, very good from the O2.

I agree the O2 didn't have the pure genius of a great Zeppelin show from any year, however the O2 was way better than a

bad '77 show. My God, the O2 showed Jimmy playing guitar straight and he was brilliant!

[Geezer]

Jimmy was better in 1977 than in 2007. He hadn't lost most of his chops by 1977.

I think Jimmy himself knows that he needs to somehow represent this tour. If anything it's the most beloved tour among Zep fans.

[nirvana]

Jimmy was better in 1977 than in 2007. He hadn't lost most of his chops by 1977.

Jimmy may have had better moments in '77 than he did at the O2 for sure. But he also had nights when he seemed so

totally lost within a given tune. His solos rambled and seemed to go nowhere. At least the O2 reminded everyone that he

was and is a guitar genius. Chops? Sure he had lost some creative edge, but all in all he was brilliant and focused.

[Geezer]

I disagree big time. Jimmy's playing was a lot more interesting in 1977 than at the O2, no matter how sloppy he was.

Also, you seem to be forgetting who was the drummer on the 1977 tour.

[nirvana]

No sir, I remember John Henry Bonham quite well no matter what year, thank you. And for his part, Jason represented his dad

proudly the night of the O2. Imagine the pressure Jason had on him and tell me that he didn't do a phenomenal job that night.

Jimmy's playing has always been interesting, even when he made one cringe, let's face it he played on the edge and when he

walked that tight-rope right to the end he was sheer magic. When he didn't - oh well, he was still Jimmy Page!

I disagree big time. Jimmy's playing was a lot more interesting in 1977 than at the O2, no matter how sloppy he was.

Also, you seem to be forgetting who was the drummer on the 1977 tour.

[Geezer]

I don't even know what to say. We're on two completely different pages. I disagree with everything you're saying.

[nirvana]

I don't even know what to say. We're on two completely different pages. I disagree with everything you're saying.

Geezer, it doesn't bother me in the least that we disagree. Hey that's what makes this forum fun and interesting.

It would be terribly boring if we all agreed on everything Zep - no?

I'm sure we can agree that we love the best music and the best Band of a by-gone era. Disagreeing on a year of

Led Zeppelin's greatness is meaningless in the scheme of things. They were pure magic in my life no matter.

Thank you for the conversation and Happy Father's day my friend!

[Geezer]

Thanks.

Yeah, that's true. Arguing is fun, really.

[ledzepfilm]

I agree. This is arguably even worse. There's even a snippet of Heartbreaker midway through the guitar solo.

If you want, I can send you a somewhat transcript of the video used for that song. Even for the others, if you'd like.

[Geezer]

Sure.