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Xolo1974

Definitive Blueberry Hill

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2 hours ago, johnlennon696 said:

47 years ago today!!

Cranking this up later.

Here here! My first Zeppelin and all time fave boot bought in 1985. My first copy had a Genesis track stamped over Moby Dick if I remember correctly. I'll be playing this today for sure!

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2 hours ago, Xolo1974 said:

anyone one know which source this is? I think it sounds pretty good

Live On Blueberry Hill (Cobra Premium Series 001). According to argenteumastrum.com it features the sources no. 1, 3 & 4 (source 4 as foundation).

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A lot of people talking about Eat A Peach - "Live On Blueberry Hill". I think it's almost a superb version of this show, however... it's almost impossible to buy. Not even on www.cdandlp.com which has the other 5 EAP releases for sale.

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1 hour ago, Moby_Dick_Ale said:

A lot of people talking about Eat A Peach - "Live On Blueberry Hill". I think it's almost a superb version of this show, however... it's almost impossible to buy. Not even on www.cdandlp.com which has the other 5 EAP releases for sale.

I’ve just got the latest Graf Zeppelin release. Hopefully it’s good 

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6 hours ago, Moby_Dick_Ale said:

A lot of people talking about Eat A Peach - "Live On Blueberry Hill". I think it's almost a superb version of this show, however... it's almost impossible to buy. Not even on www.cdandlp.com which has the other 5 EAP releases for sale.

There's another one coming from the Golden Eggs, which is likely Eat A Peach's successor, and it's called as definitive stereophonic version.

https://www.collectorsmusicreviews.com/announcements/four-new-titles-coming-from-golden-eggs/

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2 hours ago, zepster1979 said:

 There's another one coming from the Golden Eggs, which is likely Eat A Peach's successor, and it's called as definitive stereophonic version.

https://www.collectorsmusicreviews.com/announcements/four-new-titles-coming-from-golden-eggs/

That is "A Sweeter Blueberry" I downloaded a Hi Res DVD-A version years ago It's pretty good  I play it more than the other sources but that's because the whole show is on one disc. I wouldn't buy it though.

Edited by JTM

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Just my two pence, but the Eat a peach was mainly the mono source, I've been told. Golden Eggs is clearly based on the two stereo sources

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53 minutes ago, duckman said:

Just my two pence, but the Eat a peach was mainly the mono source, I've been told. Golden Eggs is clearly based on the two stereo sources

Hi mate, and what are these generally known as? Which sources? 

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3 hours ago, Xolo1974 said:

Hi mate, and what are these generally known as? Which sources? 

howde Neil!

Brannon (BootLedz) has done a scholarly research on all available sources. I prefer to keep it simple:

  • the old mono source referred to as Blimp/TMOQ. Until 1990 this was the most common and popular version thanks to the Neutral Zone volumes (and the European clones). 
  • The (real) stereo version is commonly referred to as the Cobla source (is in fact an amalgam of at least two different tapes)
  • The 'fake' stereo is called Rubber Dubber (issued as a rubber stamped double LP in 1970

the remaining sources have been released after these three and are IMHO slightly inferior sources aimed at completists. Personally I prefer the stereo tape(s), but I know there are a lot of fans of the 'classic' mono version. Releases from the past five years are mostly culled together from more than two source tapes. So it becomes a bit of a gamble to pick the right one.

Edited by duckman

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8 hours ago, duckman said:

howde Neil!

Brannon (BootLedz) has done a scholarly research on all available sources. I prefer to keep it simple:

  • the old mono source referred to as Blimp/TMOQ. Until 1990 this was the most common and popular version thanks to the Neutral Zone volumes (and the European clones). 
  • The (real) stereo version is commonly referred to as the Cobla source (is in fact an amalgam of at least two different tapes)
  • The 'fake' stereo is called Rubber Dubber (issued as a rubber stamped double LP in 1970

the remaining sources have been released after these three and are IMHO slightly inferior sources aimed at completists. Personally I prefer the stereo tape(s), but I know there are a lot of fans of the 'classic' mono version. Releases from the past five years are mostly culled together from more than two source tapes. So it becomes a bit of a gamble to pick the right one.

I seem to remember source 5 which I had on the blue 1997 Tarantura release was used by Winston for his remaster and was a good source. My mind is too cluttered now to actually remember for sure, maybe Winston can chime in. 

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The reason there is no “definitive” version of Blueberry Hill is because there are so many ways to mix the sources. Source 1 and Source 3 are most common, followed by Source 5. 

Source 2 sounds nice, but is incomplete and only on vinyl, which makes it pointless to mix with. Sources 4 and 6 are less good, but are the only ones to feature the complete band introduction, so get used for that one part. Source 4 is complete, and Source 6 misses the last couple of songs. I don’t think Source 6 has even been released anywhere on bootleg.

Source 1: TMQ Vinyl (the original bootleg to use the name “Live On Blueberry Hill”), mono source first put out on vinyl and then later released 20 years later on CD from original tapes used to make the vinyl, via the LOBH Neutral Zone CDs. Empress Valley released the pre-bootleg tapes in their box set. The EV tapes have the most tape from the source, but don’t sound as good, probably due to age.

Source 2: “Live at the Los Angeles Forum 9-4-70” - incomplete stereo source but Rubber Dubber. Only found on vinyl.

Source 3: Stereo source used on Cobla/Cobra CDs. The whole show, but spliced with other sources to fill tape cuts.

Source 4: Mono source released on Tarantura CDs from the 1990s. It’s complete, but is not as good as the other sources.

Source 5: Stereo source that was released on Tarantura 2000 box set. 

Source 6: Released online years ago. Incomplete. Not as good sounding as 1,2,3,5.

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13 hours ago, duckman said:

howde Neil!

Brannon (BootLedz) has done a scholarly research on all available sources. I prefer to keep it simple:

  • the old mono source referred to as Blimp/TMOQ. Until 1990 this was the most common and popular version thanks to the Neutral Zone volumes (and the European clones). 
  • The (real) stereo version is commonly referred to as the Cobla source (is in fact an amalgam of at least two different tapes)
  • The 'fake' stereo is called Rubber Dubber (issued as a rubber stamped double LP in 1970

the remaining sources have been released after these three and are IMHO slightly inferior sources aimed at completists. Personally I prefer the stereo tape(s), but I know there are a lot of fans of the 'classic' mono version. Releases from the past five years are mostly culled together from more than two source tapes. So it becomes a bit of a gamble to pick the right one.

Thanks Eric. Which is the primary source used in Eat a Peach? It’s a bit shrill and dry to me - sounds like a soundboard 

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2 hours ago, pluribus said:

The reason there is no “definitive” version of Blueberry Hill is because there are so many ways to mix the sources. Source 1 and Source 3 are most common, followed by Source 5. 

Source 2 sounds nice, but is incomplete and only on vinyl, which makes it pointless to mix with. Sources 4 and 6 are less good, but are the only ones to feature the complete band introduction, so get used for that one part. Source 4 is complete, and Source 6 misses the last couple of songs. I don’t think Source 6 has even been released anywhere on bootleg.

Source 1: TMQ Vinyl (the original bootleg to use the name “Live On Blueberry Hill”), mono source first put out on vinyl and then later released 20 years later on CD from original tapes used to make the vinyl, via the LOBH Neutral Zone CDs. Empress Valley released the pre-bootleg tapes in their box set. The EV tapes have the most tape from the source, but don’t sound as good, probably due to age.

Source 2: “Live at the Los Angeles Forum 9-4-70” - incomplete stereo source but Rubber Dubber. Only found on vinyl.

Source 3: Stereo source used on Cobla/Cobra CDs. The whole show, but spliced with other sources to fill tape cuts.

Source 4: Mono source released on Tarantura CDs from the 1990s. It’s complete, but is not as good as the other sources.

Source 5: Stereo source that was released on Tarantura 2000 box set. 

Source 6: Released online years ago. Incomplete. Not as good sounding as 1,2,3,5.

You’ve actually answered my question. So has any release primarily used a combo of sources 2 and 3? I have the latest Graf Zeppelin release on the way. As it’s third disc it has the vinyl rip of the rubber Dubber recording. As for discs one and two not sure which source they used. So far my go to is the Eat a Peach version....but to be honest I don’t like it. It sounds too shrill and dry to me - almost like a soundboard (assuming this is primarily source 1). 

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7 minutes ago, Xolo1974 said:

You’ve actually answered my question. So has any release primarily used a combo of sources 2 and 3? I have the latest Graf Zeppelin release on the way. As it’s third disc it has the vinyl rip of the rubber Dubber recording. As for discs one and two not sure which source they used. So far my go to is the Eat a Peach version....but to be honest I don’t like it. It sounds too shrill and dry to me - almost like a soundboard (assuming this is primarily source 1). 

Do you have Heavy Vibraphones? That uses my vinyl rip of the Rubber Dubber LP for it's disc 3. Discs 1 and 2 are the 1st TMOQ source from an unknown gen tape that has a brighter, fuller sound than many other versions of that tape.   I  wonder if Graff Zep just burned our version to silvers. 🤔

Edited by porgie66

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15 hours ago, Xolo1974 said:

You’ve actually answered my question. So has any release primarily used a combo of sources 2 and 3? I have the latest Graf Zeppelin release on the way. As it’s third disc it has the vinyl rip of the rubber Dubber recording. As for discs one and two not sure which source they used. So far my go to is the Eat a Peach version....but to be honest I don’t like it. It sounds too shrill and dry to me - almost like a soundboard (assuming this is primarily source 1). 

Eat a Peach is a mix of Source 1 from the Neutral Zone CDs, and Source 1 from Empress Valley, including the splices EV did to other sources.

There aren’t any mixes of Sources 2 with Source 3 probably because Source 3 is pretty much complete and Source 2 is only a handful of songs, most of which are incomplete. Source 5 sounds much closer to the sound of Source 3. That mix (plus some Source 1) are what the Cobla/Cobra bootlegs are.

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2 hours ago, pluribus said:

Eat a Peach is a mix of Source 1 from the Neutral Zone CDs, and Source 1 from Empress Valley, including the splices EV did to other sources.

There aren’t any mixes of Sources 2 with Source 3 probably because Source 3 is pretty much complete and Source 2 is only a handful of songs, most of which are incomplete. Source 5 sounds much closer to the sound of Source 3. That mix (plus some Source 1) are what the Cobla/Cobra bootlegs are.

Basically, it's up to personal taste. I prefer the Cobla version, and I like Heavy Vibes because acapulcogold used a better sounding tape version of source 1 than most bootlegs I've heard. Rubber Dubber is a nice alternative listen but it's very incomplete. A definitive version of this show is subjective, until another better tape comes along. 

Edited by porgie66

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On 10/19/2018 at 10:57 AM, Moby_Dick_Ale said:

A lot of people talking about Eat A Peach - "Live On Blueberry Hill". I think it's almost a superb version of this show, however... it's almost impossible to buy. Not even on www.cdandlp.com which has the other 5 EAP releases for sale.

I have ordered my copy of "A Sweeter Blueberry" on Golden Eggs (the current label name of the Godfather/Eat A Peach people) yesterday on ebay, just € 23 excl. shipping.

You have to order them very quickly after the initial release date, shortly after the price is increasing rapidly + they are really hart to find.

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1 hour ago, Autumn Moon said:

I have ordered my copy of "A Sweeter Blueberry" on Golden Eggs (the current label name of the Godfather/Eat A Peach people) yesterday on ebay, just € 23 excl. shipping.

You have to order them very quickly after the initial release date, shortly after the price is increasing rapidly + they are really hart to find.

Do you know what their source mix is? I think it may be the same as the fan share on dime from some years ago with the same title.   The following is the text from that version. 

 

 

Led Zeppelin Live at the Inglewood Forum 1970-09-04 from 2nd gen AUD reel-to-reel tape with known lineage(rec3)- *BLOWS AWAY ANY PREVIOUS VERSION* "A Sweeter Blueberry" (mp3 sample) 16 bit CD-Burnable Version

Even if you never had a bootleg by Led Zeppelin, you need this one. This recording is to Led Zeppelin what "The Coming Of Kahoutek" is to Pink Floyd collectors, or what "Live'r Than You'll Ever Be" is to The Rolling Stones. It was your very first bootleg of this group. It's an exciting, relaxed performance by the band as well. They even comment on the fact that they are enjoying themselves.

What sets the Led Zeppelin performance apart from the others is the fact that there were so many recorders in the audience that night. Did you know there were five known different tapes of this show (and this is arguably the best one)?

Determining which, if any of the existing tapes this one is has proven to be quite a journey. I am absolutely indebted to Dime member Acapulcogold for help and guidance. To the person enquiring which version of this show was the best, may I hold my hand up?

This show has been confirmed to be from the "AltTMOQ" source as put out by Empress Valley, but in much better quality. Finally, after groups of sample comparisons, it was matched to audience comments during "Whole Lotta Love". There is a vast reduction in hiss and great improvement in tonal quality over the EVSD release.

This is the red book compatible CD-burnable version

Setlist (runtime 1hr49mins18sec):

CD1
Immigrant Song
Heartbreaker
Dazed And Confused
Bring It On Home
That's The Way
Bron-Yr-Aur
Since I've Been Loving You
Organ Solo
Thank You
What Is And What Should Never Be

CD2
Moby Dick
Whole Lotta Love Medley
Communication Breakdown
Out On The Tiles
Blueberry Hill

Lineage MR reel to reel ->reel ->reel ->Sound Forge 6.0 24 bit 48KHz ->Downsampling to 16 bit 44.1Khz Track splitup ->Flac via Flac Frontend, level 6, sectors aligned and verified.

Enjoy!

A DoinkerTape
Edited by porgie66

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On 10/21/2018 at 11:15 AM, pluribus said:

Eat a Peach is a mix of Source 1 from the Neutral Zone CDs, and Source 1 from Empress Valley, including the splices EV did to other sources.

There aren’t any mixes of Sources 2 with Source 3 probably because Source 3 is pretty much complete and Source 2 is only a handful of songs, most of which are incomplete. Source 5 sounds much closer to the sound of Source 3. That mix (plus some Source 1) are what the Cobla/Cobra bootlegs are.

Toshiro!  So if the Golden Eggs version is just a rip of the Doinker Sweeter Blueberry version...would it be source 3 or source 5? 

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Just picked up a copy of Moonchild’s Winston Remaster version of this show. 

Edit: funny I just noticed it’s labeled as September 9, 1970... 

B5DC90E2-A1B3-4024-B2BC-11CDDC023869.jpeg

Edited by Walter

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3 hours ago, porgie66 said:

Toshiro!  So if the Golden Eggs version is just a rip of the Doinker Sweeter Blueberry version...would it be source 3 or source 5? 

If it is the Doinker version, then it’s Source 3. The problem with Doinker’s version is that it didn’t sound as good as the other low generation versions of Source 3. Kind of muffled on the top end for some reason.

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15 minutes ago, pluribus said:

If it is the Doinker version, then it’s Source 3. The problem with Doinker’s version is that it didn’t sound as good as the other low generation versions of Source 3. Kind of muffled on the top end for some reason.

I agree, I disregarded it after listening once...I expected it to be better based on the hype in the description. 

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The more I explore this matter, the more bloody confusing it gets 😁 @pluribus @porgie66. I managed to download from guitars 101 the EV 9 disc release from last year. 

I’ve listened to what they call the ‘Cobra source’ and I’m not that impressed. Doesn’t sound as good as the YouTube post above. 

The EV release also has a TMOQ alternate source. God knows what that is. Also an Antrabata source

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