zepscoda Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Kansas City Scouts The Kansas City Islanders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stargroves Tangie Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 The Kansas City Islanders That is quite a possibility, unless owner Wang & Nassau County get their act together to rebuild the Nassau Coliseum. Or maybe they'll become the Brooklyn Islanders at the new Barclays Center. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 That is quite a possibility, unless owner Wang & Nassau County get their act together to rebuild the Nassau Coliseum. Or maybe they'll become the Brooklyn Islanders at the new Barclays Center. You are talking about a pipe dream that you will get a franchise. They may never play hockey again. better worry about this fucking stupid ass lockout and then we will talk about new teams. My money is on Seattle. IF THEY EVER PLAY AGAIN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stargroves Tangie Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 You are talking about a pipe dream that you will get a franchise. They may never play hockey again. better worry about this fucking stupid ass lockout and then we will talk about new teams. My money is on Seattle. IF THEY EVER PLAY AGAIN I believe that there will be a season....eventually, probably starting in January. One side will have to concede more than they want to. BTW I'm on Long Island, so I don't want the Islanders moving to Kansas City or Quebec or anywhere else- even Brooklyn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Fehr, this is something you should jump on. Revenues will be 50-50, whether you accept this proposal or wait locked out for two seasons. I know you wont like the UFA age proposal, or the longer entry level contracts. They're not rolling back your salaries, which was your main goal. Take the revenue split and lack of salary rollback, and owners will give on some issues, and we can be watching hockey in early December. Please. Your foolish pr strategies are the reason the lockout occurred in the first place. Your negotiating points have been more foolish than you accuse the owners of being. I'm afraid you will just laugh and toss this proposal aside like the others, because you're a prick. Ultimately, owners will win anyway. Players should wake up and realize how good they have it, there is no way they need 57% when they don't pay a single cent in running a freaking franchise, and taking a huge business risk each year. You will never lose money, and are playing a game that every little canadien boy would play for free. And you are breaking their hearts. The owners just gave you a solid ground for negotiating. Please use it wisely, or you will find yourself down one huge hockey fan. Sincerely, Arcane29, and every NHL fan ever. Actually, the players have already agreed to the 50/50 split in HRR on any contracts signed after radification. That in itself is a 7% roll back . What they are taking issue with is the fact that the owners want that 50/50 split to be retroactive to include contracts that have already been singed, sealed, and dusted. The irony of all of this is that the players offered Bettman a 50/50 split back in 2004 which he refused because the owners were hell bent on getting a salary cap. He refused to even present that offer to the owners. Well,the owners got the salary cap they were looking for but in the years since that was agreed upon, the owners realized that they would have been better off agreeing to that original offer because HRR has far exceeded anything they gained with the cap. IMHO, this whole dispute is a bi product of Bettmans mistake in 2004 . Last I heard, there were only 7 owners who are refusing to budge on the latest player proposal . My conclusion : The players have given up a lot. The owners ! Not only are they greedy, they're stupid . Bettman.... nothing but NBA commisioner David Sterns lackie. Afterall, it looks to me as though the NBA has the most to gain by this NHL work stoppage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Actually, the players have already agreed to the 50/50 split in HRR on any contracts signed after radification. That in itself is a 7% roll back . What they are taking issue with is the fact that the owners want that 50/50 split to be retroactive to include contracts that have already been singed, sealed, and dusted. The irony of all of this is that the players offered Bettman a 50/50 split back in 2004 which he refused because the owners were hell bent on getting a salary cap. He refused to even present that offer to the owners. Well,the owners got the salary cap they were looking for but in the years since that was agreed upon, the owners realized that they would have been better off agreeing to that original offer because HRR has far exceeded anything they gained with the cap. IMHO, this whole dispute is a bi product of Bettmans mistake in 2004 . Last I heard, there were only 7 owners who are refusing to budge on the latest player proposal . My conclusion : The players have given up a lot. The owners ! Not only are they greedy, they're stupid . Bettman.... nothing but NBA commisioner David Sterns lackie. Afterall, it looks to me as though the NBA has the most to gain by this NHL work stoppage Yes, did you see I have already considered buying NBA league pass? I do like the NBA. Not like I love hockey by any means but I am looking forward somewhat to see how the Lakers and Clippers do. I do not see how this thing can get fixed any time soon after the other days develepements. It sucks. I fear there will be no season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Yes, did you see I have already considered buying NBA league pass? I do like the NBA. Not like I love hockey by any means but I am looking forward somewhat to see how the Lakers and Clippers do. I do not see how this thing can get fixed any time soon after the other days develepements. It sucks. I fear there will be no season. I think they'll get a deal done fairly soon. I don't think they're as far a part as it looks and I think it's now just a case of both Bettman and Fehr spinning it properly for public consumption Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrycja Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Actually, the players have already agreed to the 50/50 split in HRR on any contracts signed after radification. That in itself is a 7% roll back . What they are taking issue with is the fact that the owners want that 50/50 split to be retroactive to include contracts that have already been singed, sealed, and dusted. The irony of all of this is that the players offered Bettman a 50/50 split back in 2004 which he refused because the owners were hell bent on getting a salary cap. He refused to even present that offer to the owners. Well,the owners got the salary cap they were looking for but in the years since that was agreed upon, the owners realized that they would have been better off agreeing to that original offer because HRR has far exceeded anything they gained with the cap. IMHO, this whole dispute is a bi product of Bettmans mistake in 2004 . Last I heard, there were only 7 owners who are refusing to budge on the latest player proposal . My conclusion : The players have given up a lot. The owners ! Not only are they greedy, they're stupid . Bettman.... nothing but NBA commisioner David Sterns lackie. Afterall, it looks to me as though the NBA has the most to gain by this NHL work stoppage Ally I don't understand the relationship between the 50/50 split and player contracts. The 50/50 split refers to hockey generated income - profits from the product. The contracts, while not unrelated in the sense that the terms can be renegotiated in a new CBA, do not seem to be directly connected to the 50/50 split (which I think is fair - players are the product, but they don't front the costs for everything else that enables the product to be staged. I didn't agree with NBA players getting 57% share of the pie, and don't with NHLers either). What am I not understanding? Anyway, hopefully they get it done but it figures that if they don't it's in the year the Leafs have the winter classic. Meh. Bring on the NBA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcane29 Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Actually, the players have already agreed to the 50/50 split in HRR on any contracts signed after radification. That in itself is a 7% roll back . What they are taking issue with is the fact that the owners want that 50/50 split to be retroactive to include contracts that have already been singed, sealed, and dusted. The irony of all of this is that the players offered Bettman a 50/50 split back in 2004 which he refused because the owners were hell bent on getting a salary cap. He refused to even present that offer to the owners. Well,the owners got the salary cap they were looking for but in the years since that was agreed upon, the owners realized that they would have been better off agreeing to that original offer because HRR has far exceeded anything they gained with the cap. IMHO, this whole dispute is a bi product of Bettmans mistake in 2004 . Last I heard, there were only 7 owners who are refusing to budge on the latest player proposal . My conclusion : The players have given up a lot. The owners ! Not only are they greedy, they're stupid . Bettman.... nothing but NBA commisioner David Sterns lackie. Afterall, it looks to me as though the NBA has the most to gain by this NHL work stoppage I thought the last proposal left the already-signed contracts alone. In my eyes, both sides are greedy, but as soon as I heard Fehr would be the NHLPA head, I had a slant against them. Yeah, the first owner proposal was a joke. Doesn't mean you wait 1.5 months to produce your joke. Fehr wanted the lockout, it gave the owners the "evil" look. Had they gone on to play without a CBA in place, the players would've gone on strike before the playoffs anyway, after collecting a fair amount of checks first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 I thought the last proposal left the already-signed contracts alone. In my eyes, both sides are greedy, but as soon as I heard Fehr would be the NHLPA head, I had a slant against them. Yeah, the first owner proposal was a joke. Doesn't mean you wait 1.5 months to produce your joke. Fehr wanted the lockout, it gave the owners the "evil" look. Had they gone on to play without a CBA in place, the players would've gone on strike before the playoffs anyway, after collecting a fair amount of checks first. I agree, no doubt the players would have exercised their right to strike at playoff time so, the lockout itself comes as no suprise. I also share your opinion of Fehr but, after getting their asses handed to them in 2004, it is not suprising that the NHLPA opted to bring in a hired gun. Subsequently, we have two hired guns with egos and reputations the size of the Empire State building. That is why I feel that a settlement, which I do not think is far off, is going to require the spin doctor treatment. I do not believe at this stage, we are talking the owners vs the players. We are talking Fehr vs Bettman. Once they can find a way to kiss each others asses in a way that makes both of them look, good, this dispute will be over and hockey will be played. Just my opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcane29 Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 I agree, no doubt the players would have exercised their right to strike at playoff time so, the lockout itself comes as no suprise. I also share your opinion of Fehr but, after getting their asses handed to them in 2004, it is not suprising that the NHLPA opted to bring in a hired gun. Subsequently, we have two hired guns with egos and reputations the size of the Empire State building. That is why I feel that a settlement, which I do not think is far off, is going to require the spin doctor treatment. I do not believe at this stage, we are talking the owners vs the players. We are talking Fehr vs Bettman. Once they can find a way to kiss each others asses in a way that makes both of them look, good, this dispute will be over and hockey will be played. Just my opinion I believe a settlement isn't too far off as well. If we're lucky, it could be a few weeks. As I have said before, I think we watch the Winter Classic on time for sure. And I think a 50-60 game season might be good for the players, as in resting them so we see higher quality hockey for the majority of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 I believe a settlement isn't too far off as well. If we're lucky, it could be a few weeks. As I have said before, I think we watch the Winter Classic on time for sure. And I think a 50-60 game season might be good for the players, as in resting them so we see higher quality hockey for the majority of the season. Agreed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Agreed I wish I could share your optomism? I do not know where you guys are getting it? Certainly not from Fehr? Or Bettman? I thought the last proposal was a slam dunk and they walked out of the room after an hour. Does not look good from my perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Ally I don't understand the relationship between the 50/50 split and player contracts. The 50/50 split refers to hockey generated income - profits from the product. The contracts, while not unrelated in the sense that the terms can be renegotiated in a new CBA, do not seem to be directly connected to the 50/50 split (which I think is fair - players are the product, but they don't front the costs for everything else that enables the product to be staged. I didn't agree with NBA players getting 57% share of the pie, and don't with NHLers either). What am I not understanding? Anyway, hopefully they get it done but it figures that if they don't it's in the year the Leafs have the winter classic. Meh. Bring on the NBA. Actually Pat, as I understand it, it all depends on how a person reads into things. Since 2004, the players have been paying a percentage of their salary into an Esgrow account, This account could be dipped into by, both the owners and the players to ... 1) make up for any shortfall in either party's share of HRR 2) the owners could also , should their club say sign a player or players to contracts that would put them over the cap, dip into that account to pay the difference between the cap and the annual salary of the players. This effectively meant that a club could go over the cap and not be called onto the carpet for doing so. It also meant that the players were effectively subsidizing the owners and their own salaries . In this round of negotiations, the owners want the players to pay a higher percentage into that account and they want to make it retroactive . The players see this as a rollback in wages for players at the bottom end of the contractual scale . Hope I've explained that right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 http://sports.nationalpost.com/2012/10/21/nhl-believes-deal-to-end-lockout-is-on-the-table/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrycja Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Actually Pat, as I understand it, it all depends on how a person reads into things. Since 2004, the players have been paying a percentage of their salary into an Esgrow account, This account could be dipped into by, both the owners and the players to ... 1) make up for any shortfall in either party's share of HRR 2) the owners could also , should their club say sign a player or players to contracts that would put them over the cap, dip into that account to pay the difference between the cap and the annual salary of the players. This effectively meant that a club could go over the cap and not be called onto the carpet for doing so. It also meant that the players were effectively subsidizing the owners and their own salaries . In this round of negotiations, the owners want the players to pay a higher percentage into that account and they want to make it retroactive . The players see this as a rollback in wages for players at the bottom end of the contractual scale . Hope I've explained that right Yeah that explains it well, thanks, Ally. Simply put, the system is quite different from that of the NBA whose context I was imposing onto the NHL negotiations as a default. And yes, it's completely unfair of the NHL to impose any such stipulation onto the players. SMDH... Given that their recent meeting was but an hour, it's a bad sign. Usually when something is worth negotiating, they'll spend more time on it. Then again, the NBA season looked equally as bleak, and Stern said that even in the last meeting they had he felt the season was done until a breakthrough occurred literally in the last half hour of negotiation. Poof! Christmas games! Betman may have learned from Stern, but Stern's legendary for his ornery, bullish tactics. Oh to be a fly on those walls... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Yeah that explains it well, thanks, Ally. Simply put, the system is quite different from that of the NBA whose context I was imposing onto the NHL negotiations as a default. And yes, it's completely unfair of the NHL to impose any such stipulation onto the players. SMDH... Given that their recent meeting was but an hour, it's a bad sign. Usually when something is worth negotiating, they'll spend more time on it. Then again, the NBA season looked equally as bleak, and Stern said that even in the last meeting they had he felt the season was done until a breakthrough occurred literally in the last half hour of negotiation. Poof! Christmas games! Betman may have learned from Stern, but Stern's legendary for his ornery, bullish tactics. Oh to be a fly on those walls... I may be being overly optomistic but I think the players themselves are getting a bit antsy and from what I've heard, there are only 7 of the leagues owners who are holding a hard line. Also, I believe it's this week that the players can access that Esgrow fund to effectively pay themselves " Strike pay ". If it's like most funds of that nature, they'll have to replace whatever is taken out and that in effect would make any already agreed to contribution ...larger . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Yeah that explains it well, thanks, Ally. Simply put, the system is quite different from that of the NBA whose context I was imposing onto the NHL negotiations as a default. And yes, it's completely unfair of the NHL to impose any such stipulation onto the players. SMDH... Given that their recent meeting was but an hour, it's a bad sign. Usually when something is worth negotiating, they'll spend more time on it. Then again, the NBA season looked equally as bleak, and Stern said that even in the last meeting they had he felt the season was done until a breakthrough occurred literally in the last half hour of negotiation. Poof! Christmas games! Betman may have learned from Stern, but Stern's legendary for his ornery, bullish tactics. Oh to be a fly on those walls... You would probably hear the sounds of silence from how it sounds. Someone else needs to step in and give it to Bettman and 'Fehr. I must concede I do not like this Fehr guy from what I have heard come out of his mouth so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 http://www.nhl.com/ Islanders moving to Brooklyn in 2015. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zepscoda Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 No Sleep till Brooklyn!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul carruthers Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/8547114/gary-bettman-little-hope-nhl-playing-82-game-season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 Incredible that its come to this. That they can allow this to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrycja Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 You would probably hear the sounds of silence from how it sounds. Someone else needs to step in and give it to Bettman and 'Fehr. I must concede I do not like this Fehr guy from what I have heard come out of his mouth so far. A lot of bs from both sides. There's always posturing in negotiations to see who'll blink first (and Stern's a master at not blinking. Ever.) but it's just such a shame that we're likely going to endure another lockout. No Winter Classic for the Leafs either grrrr! As for the Isles, well, they couldn't make it work at Nassau, and Barclay's is a beautiful alternative. Prokhorov is already reaping returns from his huge investment wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 A lot of bs from both sides. There's always posturing in negotiations to see who'll blink first (and Stern's a master at not blinking. Ever.) but it's just such a shame that we're likely going to endure another lockout. No Winter Classic for the Leafs either grrrr! As for the Isles, well, they couldn't make it work at Nassau, and Barclay's is a beautiful alternative. Prokhorov is already reaping returns from his huge investment wow. To me the Islanders move is meaningless. This strike is killing our game. I mean how stupid can they be? Do they not know what is at stake here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Then that classless piece of shit Brett Hull, one way player and not half of what his father was, carves a pumpkin to look like the "no goal" he was awarded along with a Stanley Cup they did not deserve, Dallas cant sell out a game. Fans suck. Hull sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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