LedZeppfan77 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 NHLPA has made another offer and both sides have been at the table all afternoon. Fehr announced he expected an answer at 1pm but obviously it has not yet happened. But there has been no turn down either. Today is a make or break day for this season to be saved. I am cautiously optomistic that something will give in the next hour or two. Lets hope its for the puck to drop The reports are the two sides are 182 Million dollars apart, but that is considered miniscule in sports terms. So there is no reason to think they cant walk out of there and "split the baby" and get the damn season started Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul carruthers Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 They're expecting to announce on Friday the cancellation of the all-star game. If that happens, I think you can kiss the season goodbye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 They're expecting to announce on Friday the cancellation of the all-star game. If that happens, I think you can kiss the season goodbye. Bettman is a pure fucker. It now looks hopeless. I do not believe their will be a season. Incredible. One guy called Bettman an idiot publicly. Why is he bothering to apologize now? Bettman and Daly are bastards and Fehr is not far behind them. Halak just signed in Germany. The Sedin Twins will now only sign a one year contract if there is hockey next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey/nhl/article/1290890--nhl-lockout-players-association-tables-proposal-as-negotiations-resume Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcane29 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 I still think they come to terms at some point, why pretend to talk if you know the season won't happen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 I still think they come to terms at some point, why pretend to talk if you know the season won't happen... As I understand it, in terms of straight money, the two side are about $180m apart . As it stands, the players now have 57% of all HHR. Their proposal on getting to 50/50 on HRR is a decending one. 56% in the 1st yr 50% by the 5th yr. That decending proposal is based on the owners stand of not making existing signed player contracts whole. If the owners were to agree to making those existing contracts whole for say the first 2yrs then that would bring a proposal from the players that would give the owners pretty close to the 50% of HRR that they're looking for immediately. Just as importantly, it would also put both sides back in a position to seriously negotiate other matters such as free agency and pentions. Just stating the facts as I understand them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 As I understand it, in terms of straight money, the two side are about $180m apart . As it stands, the players now have 57% of all HHR. Their proposal on getting to 50/50 on HRR is a decending one. 56% in the 1st yr 50% by the 5th yr. That decending proposal is based on the owners stand of not making existing signed player contracts whole. If the owners were to agree to making those existing contracts whole for say the first 2yrs then that would bring a proposal from the players that would give the owners pretty close to the 50% of HRR that they're looking for immediately. Just as importantly, it would also put both sides back in a position to seriously negotiate other matters such as free agency and pentions. Just stating the facts as I understand them This type of shit is for lawyers and financial experts. NOT FANS. Fuck Bettman. Fuck Fehr. Fuck Daly. And all of them. Its a LOSE LOSE situation. The owners, players and fans all LOSE. And at the end of the day hockey no longer exists on any signifigant level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcane29 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 As I understand it, in terms of straight money, the two side are about $180m apart . As it stands, the players now have 57% of all HHR. Their proposal on getting to 50/50 on HRR is a decending one. 56% in the 1st yr 50% by the 5th yr. That decending proposal is based on the owners stand of not making existing signed player contracts whole. If the owners were to agree to making those existing contracts whole for say the first 2yrs then that would bring a proposal from the players that would give the owners pretty close to the 50% of HRR that they're looking for immediately. Just as importantly, it would also put both sides back in a position to seriously negotiate other matters such as free agency and pentions. Just stating the facts as I understand them This sounds right. I have kinda stopped reading into any proposal or discussion, and won't read into another proposed CBA until it is the real one. I've actually had more fun than I would've thought watching AHL, QMJHL, and OHL games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 This type of shit is for lawyers and financial experts. NOT FANS. Fuck Bettman. Fuck Fehr. Fuck Daly. And all of them. Its a LOSE LOSE situation. The owners, players and fans all LOSE. And at the end of the day hockey no longer exists on any signifigant level It'll exist on a significant level but maybe what has to happen is for the NHL brass to accept the fact that they need to drop franchises in some areas and get out of the buisness of subsidizing. That issue on it's own is making these negotiations next to impossible. The owners are speculating as to how much that will cost them over the term of an agreement . The players are saying they can't agree to speculative figures. Believe me, more than anyone on either side is willing to admit, it's at the very core of these negotiations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 It'll exist on a significant level but maybe what has to happen is for the NHL brass to accept the fact that they need to drop franchises in some areas and get out of the buisness of subsidizing. That issue on it's own is making these negotiations next to impossible. The owners are speculating as to how much that will cost them over the term of an agreement . The players are saying they can't agree to speculative figures. Believe me, more than anyone on either side is willing to admit, it's at the very core of these negotiations I dont know Ally. I am really worried about this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
in_the_evening Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I don't know enough about the NHL, but why can't they do like the NFL does? Some amount of money is pooled and fed out evenly to ALL teams, so even small market teams (or teams currently struggling, i.e. Miami Doplhins) can stay where they are? And then if you have super luxury seats or whatever else, you can keep that for yourself? Seems to keep a lot of labor harmony in the NFL (mostly) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 I don't know enough about the NHL, but why can't they do like the NFL does? Some amount of money is pooled and fed out evenly to ALL teams, so even small market teams (or teams currently struggling, i.e. Miami Doplhins) can stay where they are? And then if you have super luxury seats or whatever else, you can keep that for yourself? Seems to keep a lot of labor harmony in the NFL (mostly) As crazy as it may sound, IMHO, the pooling of money is exactly the reason the two party's can't get on page one. Albiet an issue of percentages and who get's what.. Unlike the NFL, the NHL has franchises that aren't viable and for all intents and purposes, will never be viable. Understandably, the successful franchises ( owners) want to limit their loss but, they want the players share of hockey related revenue, ( the extra 7% that the players currently have ) to be the make weight. The oplayers are saying that the figures the owners are coming up with are, a guess at best. That being said, I agree completely with you. That's why my personal feeling is that the league should drop these unseuccessful franchises and work on a basis of real money. It wouldn't necessarilly eliminate collective bargaining from the process but, at least both sides would know exactly how much real money was in the pot. Can't see how anyone can negotiate when that issue is not clear Rick, you seem to forget that there was hockey before Bettman...lol. Damn good hockey too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul carruthers Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/8665720/nhl-cancels-games-dec-14-plus-all-star-weekend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 http://espn.go.com/n...ll-star-weekend That is no surprise and really no real news. This thing is a joke. Bad feelings on both sides and the players I think are even fed up. I cant imagine most of them willing to sit a whole year over fighting over extra money. Cant see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 An interesting read http://www.montrealgazette.com/sports/Hickey+proves+rich+people+different/7602720/story.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 An interesting read http://www.montrealg...2720/story.html Well now I hate the Bruins more than I did before. If thats possible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted November 26, 2012 Share Posted November 26, 2012 http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=410312 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=410312 Ill come back and read it Ally after I finish my law degree at Harvard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Ill come back and read it Ally after I finish my law degree at Harvard. Good one ! Looks like mediation is the next course of action. Can't see it doing much of anything though. They did this in 2004 and two days later, Bettman cancelled the season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Good one ! Looks like mediation is the next course of action. Can't see it doing much of anything though. They did this in 2004 and two days later, Bettman cancelled the season It offers some hope. At least they sense the desperation and are realizing nobody wins if they cancel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zepscoda Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Rangers Join Flyers in Atlantic City Hockey Benefit After Sandy : Members of the New York Rangers and Philadelphia Flyers will join other locked out National Hockey League players in a charity game to benefit those affected by Hurricane Sandy. The Rangers’ Ryan Callahan and Brad Richards, the Flyers’ Scott Hartnell and Kimmo Timonen, and former Flyer Simon Gagne, now with the Los Angeles Kings, are among the players who will participate in the Nov. 24 game at Boardwalk Hall in Atlantic City, New Jersey, according to the Facebook page for the event, titled “Operation Hat Trick.” Others joining the benefit include the Rangers’ Brian Boyle, Jeff Halpern and Steve Eminger; the Flyers’ Braydon Coburn and Jody Shelley; the Toronto Maple Leafs’ James Van Riemsdyk, a Middletown, New Jersey, native; the Washington Capitals’ John Carlson; the Buffalo Sabres’ Ville Leino; the Anaheim Ducks’ Bobby Ryan, who is from Cherry Hill, New Jersey; and the Pittsburgh Penguins’ James Neal, according to the New York Post. http://mobile.businessweek.com/news/2012-11-16/rangers-join-flyers-in-atlantic-city-hockey-benefit-after-sandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 What in God's name are they doing in there? Something has to give this week. If they are to have a season at all? One Philly fan has put out a petition to boycott the first game if and when they come back. Good idea but it will never work. There is no such thing as strength in numbers from a fan base whether its sports, music or anything else. There is no way to get everyone to go along with it. Just as many will be waiting in their seats eagerly waiting for the first puck to drop. I do not know how they are doing it but in Buffalo at least the Sabres have not made any cuts to employees yet and have not planned to. I am going to go check the AHL standings and see how Rochester is doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 What in God's name are they doing in there? Something has to give this week. If they are to have a season at all? One Philly fan has put out a petition to boycott the first game if and when they come back. Good idea but it will never work. There is no such thing as strength in numbers from a fan base whether its sports, music or anything else. There is no way to get everyone to go along with it. Just as many will be waiting in their seats eagerly waiting for the first puck to drop. I do not know how they are doing it but in Buffalo at least the Sabres have not made any cuts to employees yet and have not planned to. I am going to go check the AHL standings and see how Rochester is doing. This thing could be settled if the ownwer's agreed to make existing player contracts whole and the players backed off on a yearly incrimental drop in their share of HRR. I'm sure that's what the mediators will propose but the real problem is which side will agree to blink first and do it. Given the ego's involved at the negotiating table, I'm not confident either side will have the guts to make the first step. To me, the only way this is going to get settled is if Binding Arbitration is threatened and that decision would have to come from a higher power . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedZeppfan77 Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 This thing could be settled if the ownwer's agreed to make existing player contracts whole and the players backed off on a yearly incrimental drop in their share of HRR. I'm sure that's what the mediators will propose but the real problem is which side will agree to blink first and do it. Given the ego's involved at the negotiating table, I'm not confident either side will have the guts to make the first step. To me, the only way this is going to get settled is if Binding Arbitration is threatened and that decision would have to come from a higher power . The longer it goes on, the longer all parties involved lose. I believe something has to give and soon. If there is a shortened season its a certainty there will be no games between east and west opponents. Not enough games for that to happen. The Sabres were scheduled to be on a record number of times. After the last lockout they were the best team. i am hoping for a repeat there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ebk Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Yesterday, when I saw Marvin Miller as a headline in the paper, I thought perhaps he was going to help in the negotiation and I thought that may actually help. Unfortunately, it was because he died. Ah well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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