Led Zeppelin and the Vietnam War

[danelectro59]

Did they ever make an official statement on the war?

I've looked and listened to a few early interviews and haven't heard a word on the subject. Was this by design? Most artists of the day were vehemently opposed and made no bones about saying so. But I can't find anything from Zep. The closest I got was some interviewer saying something about Spiro Agnew (then US Vice President), and receiving a hardy round of laughter from Plant and Co.

Now, I haven't the knowledge that some of you have here, so maybe you can shed some new info on this.

[lucyinthesky]

I havenT a big knowledge either but i read< interviews in which they are very sarcastic about the american gouvernement and Page was at least in the early days strictly pacifistic. I could look for the interview (dunno where i found it) if you want to.

But led zep were not at all a political band.

[eternal light]

The pain of war cannot exceed the woe of aftermath

[MadScreamingGallery]

Did they ever make an official statement on the war?

I've looked and listened to a few early interviews and haven't heard a word on the subject. Was this by design? Most artists of the day were vehemently opposed and made no bones about saying so. But I can't find anything from Zep. The closest I got was some interviewer saying something about Spiro Agnew (then US Vice President), and receiving a hardy round of laughter from Plant and Co.

Now, I haven't the knowledge that some of you have here, so maybe you can shed some new info on this.

I never heard LZ utter a word about the war either - at least not from what I can remember from any of the concerts I attended during the early to mid-70's. I don't want to leave the impression that my friends and I were shallow or didn't have a social conscience but we actually liked the fact that we could attend Zep concerts and just have a great time listening to their incredible music without being preached to by the band members or having them spend time making political statements. Everyone I knew at that time (including my teachers) was opposed to the war and to the draft (although none of us were old enough to have been drafted) but, when we went to hear Zep, it was all about the music - we wanted to hear and experience Led Zeppelin. All these years and concerts later, for me, nothing came close to the experience of those LZ concerts.

[Cactus]

On the DVD at the NY press conference this question is sort of answered;

Q - You do message songs - what would you say the message is?

RP - It's a message of enjoyment really.

Zeppelin never made specific political comments on any subject - there is a general philosophy of life which is present across their work, but no mentions of any specific stance on anything, really.

[danelectro59]

I havenT a big knowledge either but i read< interviews in which they are very sarcastic about the american gouvernement and Page was at least in the early days strictly pacifistic. I could look for the interview (dunno where i found it) if you want to.

But led zep were not at all a political band.

Yes, if you could, I would appreciate it.

The reason i have an interest in this is that this was an important time in history and reflects upon how we are now. Many on this forum may not have even been born, but then again, i'm sure there are an equal number who were. As time goes on, it gets farther away and things get lost. Thankfully we have certain outlets, such as YouTube, where we can dial up the past and relive great memories. Having said that, LZ was becoming the biggest group in the world, and if they had any input into a subject so volatile as the war, I think it is a part of history. I don't think their music has any reflection on this, but i'm sure some journalist, somewhere, had to ask their thoughts. Now, knowing Grant and his Gestapo tactics, maybe it was a prerequisite to interviews, that this was taboo, so it wasn't asked. I do know, the press was different in those days, and they did give celebs a little breathing room. Today, it's the stalkarazzi mentality, and anything a faint scent of a controversy is printed pronto. So yes, anything you can come up with would be cool.

[Knebby]

On the DVD at the NY press conference this question is sort of answered;

Q - You do message songs - what would you say the message is?

RP - It's a message of enjoyment really.

Zeppelin never made specific political comments on any subject - there is a general philosophy of life which is present across their work, but no mentions of any specific stance on anything, really.

True, though Plant has made his political feelings pretty clear in his solo work.

[reids]

Yes. Fate of Nations CD comes to mind.

R

[Knebby]

Yes. Fate of Nations CD comes to mind.

R

Oil oil oil!

And Mighty Rearranger.

[slave to zep]

I've heard stories of the American tanks blasting out Whole Lotta Love on their loud speakers as they rode into battle with the North Vietnamese. Imagine the looks on them as they listened to Jimmy on guitar and Robert singing! They probably knocked off a few of them without needing bullets.

really? if thats true, its too cool! GUITAR ARMY!

[Smitty123]

I've always heard that Night Flight was a statement on avoiding the draft. I could quite possibly be incorrect though.

[pop]

Yes they were not politically motivated as a band. They even resisted doing benefit concerts back then. You can find an interview with John Paul Jones in Australia on Youtube where he talks about this.

They always espoused peace and love etc in their songs and interviews but seemed to largely avoid direct comments on specific things. I can relate to that.

[bonzo1026]

Oil oil oil!

And Mighty Rearranger.

Freedom Fries is about as blatant as I've ever heard.

[MadScreamingGallery]

I've heard stories of the American tanks blasting out Whole Lotta Love on their loud speakers as they rode into battle with the North Vietnamese. Imagine the looks on them as they listened to Jimmy on guitar and Robert singing! They probably knocked off a few of them without needing bullets.

I heard stories like that too (LZ and other rock music being blasted as the American soldiers went into battle) - whether they are true or not, I don't know. What I do know is that all of the American guys I knew who were drafted and sent to Vietnam listened to LZ while they were over there. Most of them were just teenagers or in their early 20's and, while they were over in Nam, they listened to the same music that we listened to over here: LZ, Stones, Hendrix, Beatles, etc.

I've always heard that Night Flight was a statement on avoiding the draft. I could quite possibly be incorrect though.

I don't know about that because, from what my husband has told me, he clearly remembers the draft lottery ended at the beginning of '73 - the year he turned 18 and was eligible for the draft. That was two years before PG was released although I don't know when the song was written - it could be that it was written earlier, when the draft was in full swing.

[Neil J]

Given the very conscious decision to penetrate the American market in the late 60s, it probably didn't make much business sense to step into a country and start bad mouthing the current foreign policy (especially in those more hawkish, conservative states).

I suppose the general, vaguely pro-peace and love ideological position of the band is more than implicit in songs like Going to California, That's The Way... etc. You could, at a stretch, read Immigrant Song as a celebration of wanton aggression (and it appeared around the time Nixon was conducting secret bombing missions in Cambodia) but I think it was written and performed with a sense of fun and irony.

I know that Plant did air political opinions onstage during the 75 Earl's Court shows, making direct (albeit jokey) reference to the UK's restictive tax laws and his impending tax exile.

[59LesPaul]

Didn't the band have to leave America in a hurry in 1969,to avoid being eligible for the draft?I seem to recall reading somewhere that their work visas were about to expire,therefore making them potentially all eligible for military service.

[LedJunkie]

I don't know about that because, from what my husband has told me, he clearly remembers the draft lottery ended at the beginning of '73 - the year he turned 18 and was eligible for the draft. That was two years before PG was released although I don't know when the song was written - it could be that it was written earlier, when the draft was in full swing.

Isn't that the case with PG? Some of the material was earlier recordings and some was new material. That definitely could explain the release.

[MadScreamingGallery]

Isn't that the case with PG? Some of the material was earlier recordings and some was new material. That definitely could explain the release.

You're right. My Zep knowledge is pretty narrow - I can only remember the concerts and when the albums were released. I really don't know when the individual songs were written and where and when they were recorded.

[danelectro59]

Didn't the band have to leave America in a hurry in 1969,to avoid being eligible for the draft?I seem to recall reading somewhere that their work visas were about to expire,therefore making them potentially all eligible for military service.

I don't think the US can draft non US citizens into the military. That's highly unethical, although I'm sure many of the military hawks would've loved to get their hands on those "damn hippies."

During the Civil War, they did grab Irish immigrants right off the boat, swear them in as citizens, then send them off to battle, but that was another day and age.

[widget]

They weren't even American citizens so how could they be drafted? UK wasn't at war with Vietnam.

Didn't the band have to leave America in a hurry in 1969,to avoid being eligible for the draft?I seem to recall reading somewhere that their work visas were about to expire,therefore making them potentially all eligible for military service.

[59LesPaul]

I don't think the US can draft non US citizens into the military. That's highly unethical, although I'm sure many of the military hawks would've loved to get their hands on those "damn hippies."

During the Civil War, they did grab Irish immigrants right off the boat, swear them in as citizens, then send them off to battle, but that was another day and age.

They weren't even American citizens so how could they be drafted? UK wasn't at war with Vietnam.

Because;if I recall correctly,if they were in America for longer than six months out of a calendar year,they were potentially eligible for service despite the fact that they weren't American citizens.

[Cactus]

Because;if I recall correctly,if they were in America for longer than six months out of a calendar year,they were potentially eligible for service despite the fact that they weren't American citizens.

Certainly non-citizens were required to pay tax...why not require them to fight your wars too.

[pop]

Night Flight was written for Led Zeppelin 4 I believe so it was written during the war.

Immigrant song I think was allegorical somewhat but I don't think written with the idea of Vietnam. I think Robert was enjoying the Nordic references to their own pillaging and looting, Hammer of the Gods comes in this song of course which is perhaps his mystical impression of the band at the time and the part about peace and love is more of an altruistic statement than a direct comment on the war. This is my perception anyway.

As to their keeping hush in the States they were not a very political band in the first place and at that time were literally concerned with their very survival with having to deal with all the rednecks as they traveled alone through the States.

[MadScreamingGallery]

Because;if I recall correctly,if they were in America for longer than six months out of a calendar year,they were potentially eligible for service despite the fact that they weren't American citizens.

You know, now that I think about this I seem to remember reading or hearing something about the six month business and Peter Grant making sure that they were out of the U.S. before six months had elapsed. I wish I could remember where I read it.

[widget]

I find it hard to believe the US government can enforce this on foreign nationals. As I understand US law, a foreign national can volunteer to fight for the US military but cannot be conscripted. The draft is only for US citizens over the age of 18. If not conscripted, Pentagon policy stipulates that only immigrants legally residing in the United States are eligible to volunteer and enlist. When a foreign national decides to enlist they have to apply to become a US citizen.

My understanding of the 6 months deal with Led Zeppelin tours was that if they stayed more than 6 months they had to pay additional income tax. This was mentioned in Davis' and Cole's book off the top of my head.

Meg

Because;if I recall correctly,if they were in America for longer than six months out of a calendar year,they were potentially eligible for service despite the fact that they weren't American citizens.