BIGDAN Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 They are rights, they just are not absolute. Thats where youre missing the whole definition of the word. Hi WBD, As far as i'm concerned your "Rights" cannot be taken away, hence the "Right to Die" Right? "Privileges" can, if your "Rights" have been taken away or altered then they were never "Rights" in the First Place, only "Privileges". Thats my Logic, and thats all i have to say on the matter, Madders you have the floor. Regards, Danny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ally Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 If you are innocent, what do you have to worry about? Quotas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 I believe he was referring to driving which is a privilege NOT! a right, the blood drawing is another matter. naw, he literally thinks no one has rights except the right die. WE've had this discussion before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wanna be drummer Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Hi WBD, As far as i'm concerned your "Rights" cannot be taken away, hence the "Right to Die" Right? "Privileges" can, if your "Rights" have been taken away or altered then they were never "Rights" in the First Place, only "Privileges". Thats my Logic, and thats all i have to say on the matter, Madders you have the floor. Regards, Danny It's not a "right" to die, that's merely a biological fact. Everyone dies, but it's not a right, it merely must happen eventually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Hartman Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 They wont take mine without my permission this is for certain. It's been tried Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGDAN Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 It's not a "right" to die, that's merely a biological fact. Everyone dies, but it's not a right, it merely must happen eventually. Hi WBD, I just have a different way of looking at things than most people, you obviously dont agree with me and thats fine, but its my opinion and i have the "Privilege" to have it, or is it my "Right" i'm not quite sure? When you are Dying i can assure you you will be offered the "Last Rights" and not the "Last Privileges" if a catholic priest is around. My Logic is this, If its a "Right" then No-one can take it away. If its a "Privilege" then Someone can take it away. These are just my opinions, you can have yours as well, but just because someone gave you a "Bill of Rights" sometime back does not mean i have to go along with it, i have my own mind and i see what i see and thats how i come to my conclutions, however wrong they sometimes might be. Kind Regards, Danny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manderlyh Posted September 16, 2009 Author Share Posted September 16, 2009 Idaho. Footsteps, if you wanna picket, you're welcome to stay in our house in Boise! They wont take mine without my permission this is for certain. It's been tried But then will you get charges pressed against you for physically impeding an officer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGDAN Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 But then will you get charges pressed against you for physically impeding an officer? Hi Madders, Do you or anyone else know for certain if any of you "Rights" are in fact being infringed under your "Bill of Rights" as this would seem to solve the Legality of the matter. Kind Regards, Danny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manderlyh Posted September 16, 2009 Author Share Posted September 16, 2009 I'm thinking that if you have to have a signed piece of paper or verbal consent for medical treatment/the drawing of blood that it doesn't give ill-trained cops in a risy environment a leg to stand on, but I don't know much about it. It just pisses me off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electrophile Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Hi Madders, Do you or anyone else know for certain if any of you "Rights" are in fact being infringed under your "Bill of Rights" as this would seem to solve the Legality of the matter. Kind Regards, Danny Gee, I think our 4th amendment rights protecting us from illegal search and seizure come into play here. I would think that if this particular law was challenged in the State Supreme Court on the grounds that taking the blood of someone who is suspected of being intoxicated is unreasonable and irresponsible, it might be overturned. A Breathalyzer should be enough to determine drunkenness at the site. If the police think there's more to it, you arrest the person. We have a fundamental right to some semblance of privacy and the forced drawing of blood is an invasion of that. Get a court order to take a blood sample, that's what prosecutors/cops have to do all the time when paternity is in question, when they need a DNA sample from a defendant to match against material already in evidence, when they have to compel a rapist to take an AIDS test, etc,. I hate drunk drivers and hope they all rot in hell, but let's play by the book, here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGDAN Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Gee, I think our 4th amendment rights protecting us from illegal search and seizure come into play here. I would think that if this particular law was challenged in the State Supreme Court on the grounds that taking the blood of someone who is suspected of being intoxicated is unreasonable and irresponsible, it might be overturned. A Breathalyzer should be enough to determine drunkenness at the site. If the police think there's more to it, you arrest the person. We have a fundamental right to some semblance of privacy and the forced drawing of blood is an invasion of that. Get a court order to take a blood sample, that's what prosecutors/cops have to do all the time when paternity is in question, when they need a DNA sample from a defendant to match against material already in evidence, when they have to compel a rapist to take an AIDS test, etc,. I hate drunk drivers and hope they all rot in hell, but let's play by the book, here. Hi and thanks Liz, Over here in England the Police can only ask for a Blood Sample as Breath or Urine Samples can be used in Court, and if you refuse altogether you get done for failing to Supply a Specimen which carries the same penalty as Drink Driving. They can only forcibly take DNA from your hair or mouth if you refuse to give them a sample when asked, and when relevant, and this procedure is not very intrusive. Only time and a Court case will tell i suppose, and thanks again for being so pleasant. Kind Regards, Danny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Hartman Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 But then will you get charges pressed against you for physically impeding an officer? In the end everyone was laughing their ass off over the whole thing. I hate needles and I'd rather be charged with defending my rights. I will keep the entire story under the hat. BTW, I've never heard of anyone push this issue too hard. They just charge you with something else, you pay and that's that. Nobody wants to get stuck for no reason, including cops and nurses. I mean who in their right mind would fight someone and risk getting killed or sued because they refuse a blood draw. This one will wind up in the Supreme Courts just like forcing medical tests on children of parents who follow religious cults. Same principal really. Good subject... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~tangerine~ Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 This is complete bullshit!! I can't even believe this! Cops standing on the side of roads, holding down angry drunks and trying to stab them with needles, meanwhile getting stabbed themselves because the guy won't cooperate? Yeah, that sounds like a real good plan! This doesn't scare me - this pisses me the fuck off! Seriously, where can I go and picket against this? And cops drawing blood? Yeah, I'd like to see that. Even if it was in the calm, clean, well-lit environment that nurses get to operate in, dollars to effing donuts they'd still suck at it! I can't tell you how many NURSES can't draw blood worth a shit, let alone a friggin' COP! And on the side of the road, with nowhere to sit, and at night! One of my best friends is a cop, and I can tell you right now, he could take 5 years of training and I still wouldn't let him near my arm! Any motherfucker comes near me with a needle, I swear to God I will take the six months or whatever in prison because they are getting a pop in the nose, I can tell you right now. Of course, I'm not going to drive drunk, but NOBODY should have to do this, no matter how brain dead they are. I know you meant this post to be serious, but it's so funny :) Shows how obnoxious this idea is in the first place. Great post! btw. this will never happen in my city. The budget is set to cut more policemen and firefighters (they will need to employ Phlebotomists to ride with the police, lol). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virginia Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 I guess the logic is that policemen can perform CPR so therefore they should be able to draw blood too? Just as nonsensical as school secretaries dispensing medication to children. If I were a police officer (or a school secretary) I would refuse to do it; wouldn't want the responsibility or the risk. (And I doubt they are compensated accordingly either) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Hartman Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 I guess the logic is that policemen can perform CPR so therefore they should be able to draw blood too? Just as nonsensical as school secretaries dispensing medication to children. If I were a police officer (or a school secretary) I would refuse to do it; wouldn't want the responsibility or the risk. (And I doubt they are compensated accordingly either) I agree Virginia. I think we have a case of a few drunken people trying to own people when they know they cannot. I mean I've ran across police officers who think they can pretty much do anything they wish. I have news for them. Those 90 days of classes beyond the GED does not give them a license to do many things. One is employing violence on the unsuspecting public. Here the police know me. They say hello and I exchange pleasantries. But this is just because Asheville tries to watch after our citizens. Well I think they know I work with security fixes and volunteer a lot too. This never hurts. Stand up for your rights, someone tries to stick you knock the shit out of them.. That is your right in our constitution now is it not? On that note I have to get some work done.. Cheers all>>> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternal light Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 Do not assault an armed police officer. Smile at him and let him draw blood. Politely inform him of any health problems and ask to see a doctor, registered nurse or certified emergency technician. Wish the officer a nice day, thank him for his patience and kind assistance or just be quiet. Then talk to your lawyer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Hartman Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 Do not assault an armed police officer. Smile at him and let him draw blood. Politely inform him of any health problems and ask to see a doctor, registered nurse or certified emergency technician. Wish the officer a nice day, thank him for his patience and kind assistance or just be quiet. Then talk to your lawyer. Not a chance. As far as the blood draw that is. You let them poke you and worry about if the needle was clean or if you will get an infection.. Not I... I have the constitutional right to defend myself against personal injury. Period . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternal light Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 I suppose, but they will charge a person with assault against a police officer sometimes in those scenarios. Juries usually frown on those who assault police officers. If you are compliant with them, you can sue for damages if they have violated your rights while you were in a state of duress. You could try to defend yourself, but the officers are usually armed. It's one of those situations where you're kind of damned if you do and damned if you don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Hartman Posted September 18, 2009 Share Posted September 18, 2009 If you refuse to give them blood they will more than likely just lock you up and you will see a judge the next day. I think the big point here is urine or breath will give them a blood alcohol without anyone being assaulted. I view me bleeding from an arm because of having a sharp projectile shoved into me as assault.. Who is assaulting who there? I'm just defending myself// Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternal light Posted September 18, 2009 Share Posted September 18, 2009 That sounds like a good defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock Action Posted September 18, 2009 Share Posted September 18, 2009 Two words, and only two words are needed here. IT'S WRONG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
59LesPaul Posted September 18, 2009 Share Posted September 18, 2009 Two words, and only two words are needed here. IT'S WRONG. More like: FUCK THAT!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Hartman Posted September 18, 2009 Share Posted September 18, 2009 I agree, FUCK THAT. I can demonstrate how to draw blood from a broken nose in a split second though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarmy Posted September 19, 2009 Share Posted September 19, 2009 If assholes did not choose to drive drunk, then there would be no need to go to these lengths. To me, the real issue is "Why does one choose to drive drunk?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electrophile Posted September 19, 2009 Share Posted September 19, 2009 To me, the real issue is "Why does one choose to drive drunk?" Because they're idiots who have less than a teaspoon full of gray matter rattling around in their empty, arid skulls? That might be a good guess. Like I said, drunk drivers are right up there with murderers and child rapists on my "People I'd Like To See Disemboweled With Fishing Knives" list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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