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SteveAJones

Zeppelin Mysteries Hosted by Steve A. Jones

5,629 posts in this topic

^^^

Nice find. I can almost see where New York-based author Stephen Davis employed some artistic license with that article for his book. We have to bear in mind this same author wrote in his followup book, LZ: The Lost Chronicles of Led Zeppelin's 1975 Tour , about Led Zeppelin accepting a last minute booking for Austin, TX on March 7, 1975 (which never happened).

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3 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

^^^

Nice find. I can almost see where New York-based author Stephen Davis employed some artistic license with that article for his book. We have to bear in mind this same author wrote in his followup book, LZ: The Lost Chronicles of Led Zeppelin's 1975 Tour , about Led Zeppelin accepting a last minute booking for Austin, TX on March 7, 1975 (which never happened).

I really hate that book, its horrible. Davis comes across as a complete asshole and Zeppelin seem more an afterthought. The whole focus of the book is less Zeppelin on tour and more Mr. Davis recalling a sexual liaison with a former lover...on Zep's tab to boot.

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1 hour ago, IpMan said:

I really hate that book, its horrible. Davis comes across as a complete asshole and Zeppelin seem more an afterthought. The whole focus of the book is less Zeppelin on tour and more Mr. Davis recalling a sexual liaison with a former lover...on Zep's tab to boot.

It definitely pales in comparison to Hammer of the Gods, which although a sensationalized account is actually a damn good book as far as maintaining the reader's interest. I do recall reading an interview with Davis that I cannot find at the moment wherein he alludes to the second book being a cash grab. Here's another interview with Davis for those who may not be familiar with him or his other work:

http://www.bu.edu/bostonia/winter09/stephen-davis/stephen-davis.pdf 

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I recently listened to Immigrant Song at the Bath Festival, and...can anyone decipher the lyrics that Plant is singing? I find it interesting how the lyrics are still being worked on here. I recognize a few of the lyrics that would become the standard lyrics for the song, but I can't make out other parts. The recording quality definitely doesn't help either. Apologies if this has been posted before (I did a quick search on the forum and couldn't find anything).

 

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2 hours ago, ZepHead315 said:

I recently listened to Immigrant Song at the Bath Festival, and...can anyone decipher the lyrics that Plant is singing? I find it interesting how the lyrics are still being worked on here. I recognize a few of the lyrics that would become the standard lyrics for the song, but I can't make out other parts. The recording quality definitely doesn't help either. Apologies if this has been posted before (I did a quick search on the forum and couldn't find anything).

The audio quality of that recording is so poor one would have to isolated the vocals to have any real hope of discerning what is being sung. To my ears, the lyrics that differ aren't lyrics so much as they are improvisations to cover for missing lyrics.

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Posted (edited)

Ok this might not really be a mystery but I'll ask anyway. 

All of My Love is often described as being about or dedicated to Robert's late son. As far as I can tell this was only ever  media speculation that is now accepted as fact despite there being no confirmation by Robert or any in the Led Zeppelin camp. I know you could all say "just listen to the lyric" but it's very easy to temper your mind to a question when an answer has already been suggested.

Is there any real proof or am I missing something obvious?

Edited by babysquid

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Another question I've been pondering recently...how come Mike Millard missed the first four songs of the 6/23/77 show? According to The Year Of Led Zeppelin blog, his recording starts just before Since I've Been Loving You. So what happened? Did he think his tape was running when it wasn't? Did the first part somehow get lost over the years? Did he get delayed due to traffic (as reportedly happened at the 2nd Long Beach show in 75)? 

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On ‎1‎/‎9‎/‎2017 at 1:55 AM, babysquid said:

Ok this might not really be a mystery but I'll ask anyway. 

All of My Love is often described as being about or dedicated to Robert's late son. As far as I can tell this was only ever  media speculation that is now accepted as fact despite there being no confirmation by Robert or any in the Led Zeppelin camp. I know you could all say "just listen to the lyric" but it's very easy to temper your mind to a question when an answer has already been suggested.

Is there any real proof or am I missing something obvious?

It is often suggested the lyrics are inspired by the loss of Karac and/or conception of Logan, but I don't recall nor think you'll find any direct quote from Robert Plant confirming or denying this. As you know, the lyrics are very oblique and open to the listener's interpretation, which would seem to be by design. It is interesting that for the promo video for I Believe, another song also suggested (and more clearly) Karac-influenced, he chose to use the video to overtly establish that interpretation. 

 

 

6 hours ago, ZepHead315 said:

Another question I've been pondering recently...how come Mike Millard missed the first four songs of the 6/23/77 show? According to The Year Of Led Zeppelin blog, his recording starts just before Since I've Been Loving You. So what happened? Did he think his tape was running when it wasn't? Did the first part somehow get lost over the years? Did he get delayed due to traffic (as reportedly happened at the 2nd Long Beach show in 75)? 

It is often alleged the tape is incomplete because Millard forgot to press record, but he is long since deceased so we will never know for certain.

Recording includes: Since I've Been Loving You, No Quarter, [ cut ], Ten Years Gone, The Battle Of Evermore, Going To California, Black Country Woman (<< Bron-Yr-Aur Stomp..), [ cut ], White Summer (...Black Mountain Side...) >> Kashmir, Trampled Underfoot, Over The Top (...Out On The Tiles, Moby Dick...), Guitar Solo (...The Star Spangled Banner...) >> Achilles Last Stand, [ cut ], Stairway To Heaven, [ cut ], Whole Lotta Love >> Rock And Roll.

(Recording Length: Near 166 minutes).

 

 

Edited by SteveAJones

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During the re-issue interviews, Jimmy was asked if he knew at the time that All My Love was about Karac.

'I came to realise it later', he said.

So Jimmy himself believes it - but 'came to realise' suggests that he arrived at that conclusion himself, not that Robert actually told him.

All this is in contrast to Halfin's comment that 'Jimmy hated All My Love but it was about Karac, so he couldn't criticise it.'

It’s not hard to see why very few people seem to like Halfin, is it...?

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19 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

It is often suggested the lyrics are inspired by the loss of Karac and/or conception of Logan, but I don't recall nor think you'll find any direct quote from Robert Plant confirming or denying this. As you know, the lyrics are very oblique and open to the listener's interpretation, which would seem to be by design. It is interesting that for the promo video for I Believe, another song also suggested (and more clearly) Karac-influenced, he chose to use the video to overtly establish that interpretation. 

 

 

It is often alleged the tape is incomplete because Millard forgot to press record, but he is long since deceased so we will never know for certain.

Recording includes: Since I've Been Loving You, No Quarter, [ cut ], Ten Years Gone, The Battle Of Evermore, Going To California, Black Country Woman (<< Bron-Yr-Aur Stomp..), [ cut ], White Summer (...Black Mountain Side...) >> Kashmir, Trampled Underfoot, Over The Top (...Out On The Tiles, Moby Dick...), Guitar Solo (...The Star Spangled Banner...) >> Achilles Last Stand, [ cut ], Stairway To Heaven, [ cut ], Whole Lotta Love >> Rock And Roll.

(Recording Length: Near 166 minutes).

 

 

Not sure where or when, but I remember reading Millard was delayed en route to the venue on 6/23/77...maybe someone else can corroborate? 

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17 hours ago, Brigante said:

During the re-issue interviews, Jimmy was asked if he knew at the time that All My Love was about Karac.

'I came to realise it later', he said.

So Jimmy himself believes it - but 'came to realise' suggests that he arrived at that conclusion himself, not that Robert actually told him.

All this is in contrast to Halfin's comment that 'Jimmy hated All My Love but it was about Karac, so he couldn't criticise it.'

It’s not hard to see why very few people seem to like Halfin, is it...?

Thanks for that. The lyrics are open to interpretation, and purposefully so. Obviously, anyone (fans or band mates) familiar with Robert's personal situation at the time would come to realize what quite likely inspired it. Ross Halfin is entitled to his own interpretation of the song, interpretation of Jimmy's feelings about it and whatever his own opinions are. However, again, Robert should probably be the one to speak for himself, if he'd like, when it comes to explaining what inspired the lyrics he wrote.  

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1 hour ago, SteveAJones said:

 Robert should probably be the one to speak for himself, if he'd like, when it comes to explaining what inspired the lyrics he wrote.  

Absolutely.

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I don't know if this qualifies as a mystery, but I want to know more about Zeppelin and the Peace Medal Ceremony in Hiroshima in 1971.

1. Who's idea was it? Zep or promoter?

2. Zep donated their concert proceeds?

3. Was this a big deal in Japan? Or did every rock band do this etc 

 

thx 

 

 

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27 minutes ago, bluecongo said:

I don't know if this qualifies as a mystery, but I want to know more about Zeppelin and the Peace Medal Ceremony in Hiroshima in 1971.

1. Who's idea was it? Zep or promoter?

2. Zep donated their concert proceeds?

3. Was this a big deal in Japan? Or did every rock band do this etc 

thx 

Great topic and questions.

Q1 answer:  "I played in Hiroshima on the first Led Zeppelin tour of Japan, the concert was to be a benefit for the victims. The mayor presented city medals and a letter of appreciation to the band and manager Peter Grant. It made me think long and hard about the concept of war and its concentrated horror." -- Jimmy Page (2011)

Jimmy's answer suggests the original idea wasn't his nor the band's. Peter Grant undoubtedly made arrangements thru the promoter, Mr. Udo, who may or may not have been the original one to suggest it. 

Q2 answer: Yes, a total of seven million yen

http://www.ledzeppelin.com/show/september-27-1971

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/07/31/national/history/jimmy-page-pays-tribute-hiroshima-bomb-victims/#.WIoD0vl97XU

Q3 answer: The Beatles had been the first major Western rock group to perform in Japan just five years prior (Jun/Jul 1966), which more or less launched the Japanese rock scene. So this goodwill gesture, if not the first by a Western music group, certainly would have been noteworthy to the people of Hiroshima and by extension the people of Japan.

http://www.thevideobeat.com/group-sounds-gs-60s-japanese-garage-rock.htm

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http://www.ledzeppelin.com/event/september-27-1971

71_9_27_hiroshima_letter.jpg

Hiroshima Charity Concert

Led Zeppelin donates proceeds of their concert in Hiroshima to the victims of the first atomic bomb in 1945. The mayor, Setsuo Yamada, presents the band with a letter of appreciation and a city medal as a token of friendship.

Letter Translation:

To The "Led Zeppelin":

The City of Hiroshima extends to you its profound appreciation for your warm sympathy for the reflief of our atomic-bomb sufferers, and for your thoughtfulness in giving a Charity Concert for the purpose of contributing to their relief, by donating the proceeds arising therefrom to the City of Hiroshima.

September 27th, 1971

SETSUO YAMADA
Mayor
City of Hiroshima

---------------------------------------------------------

Just to add, I've spoken with more than one TV archive in Hiroshima through the years. They said there are catalog entries for "news footage" of this ceremony and concert, but they are missing.

 

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Thx for info wow hope that news footage turns up someday!

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That is one photo where the band all look very humbled and deferential. Thanks for sharing. 

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Here's a Page mystery question.  

Who was Brian Goode his by all accounts completely inept manager from 1988-1994 or thereabouts.  I can't ever recall seeing a picture of him or heard of him managing any other acts.  

How did Jimmy hook up with him?  

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On 12/27/2007 at 1:35 PM, SteveAJones said:

 

Richard Cole and John Bonham accompanied Robert on his flight home from New Orleans to the Midlands, with a brief layover in London. John Paul Jones did have his family with

him in the states for sightseeing. Peter Grant elected to remain in New Orleans to work

the cancellation of the tour's remaining dates.

 

Jimmy and JPJ did not attend Karac's funeral service and this is a highly sensitive topic. While I've never spoken to Robert concerning his thoughts on their absence; those who have discussed it with him told me he was deeply hurt by it.

 

It's inexplicable, really, for them not to have attended, as I've always believed the sudden loss of a child is one of life's cruelest tragedies. Certainly, Robert could have found some comfort in their support, however I realize everyone deals with grief of this magnitude in their own way. For whatever it's worth, bear in mind Jimmy and John Paul Jones seldom socialized with Robert and Bonzo, or between themselves, if off the road. Ultimately, in my opinion, neither excuses nor condemnations should be made.

 

In conclusion, note Jimmy and Peter Grant met in London soonafter and immediately put the band on indefinate hiatus to afford Robert an opportunity to grieve. More than a year passed before Led Zeppelin made a public appearance and resumed studio activity.

 How soon after Karac's  death did jimmy himself come back to England?   And how soon  did Peter come back? I'm not surprised Jimmy would miss the funeral since he was most likely divulging harder into drugs with all that happened within a few days but I'm surprise Peter did not go.    With Jonesey having three kids himself I'm surprised he did not come back to England to be at the funeral. 

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On 12/21/2016 at 0:31 AM, SteveAJones said:

It definitely pales in comparison to Hammer of the Gods, which although a sensationalized account is actually a damn good book as far as maintaining the reader's interest. I do recall reading an interview with Davis that I cannot find at the moment wherein he alludes to the second book being a cash grab. Here's another interview with Davis for those who may not be familiar with him or his other work:

http://www.bu.edu/bostonia/winter09/stephen-davis/stephen-davis.pdf 

 I've read  Hammer of the gods probably more than 100 times and I am not exaggerating. I think it is very poorly written.  The author comes across as petty and trying to make degrading remarks about the band members based on things that never happened.   Lord knows they are not perfect by any means but his account of what happened is just short of ridiculous. 

Edited by jasonlovesvids

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1 hour ago, jasonlovesvids said:

 I've read  Hammer of the gods probably more than 100 times and I am not exaggerating. I think it is very poorly written.  The author comes across as petty and trying to make degrading remarks about the band members based on things that never happened.   Lord knows they are not perfect by any means but his account of what happened is just short of ridiculous. 

Why would you read something 100 times if you think it's so bad?

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Hammer of the Gods ought to go in the fiction section. If you want a good Zep book, "Trampled Underfoot" by Barney Hoskyns is about the only one.

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19 hours ago, bluecongo said:

Here's a Page mystery question.  

Who was Brian Goode his by all accounts completely inept manager from 1988-1994 or thereabouts.  I can't ever recall seeing a picture of him or heard of him managing any other acts.  

How did Jimmy hook up with him?  

I'm away from my notes at the moment, not that I have many on Brian Goode, who remained very much out of the limelight and by many accounts in way over his head. Off the top of my head, his management began during The Firm era and ended in 1994 after Jimmy joined forces with Bill Curbishley, who was Robert's manager at the time. I do know it was Brian who took the call from Rod McSween in January 1991 to inquire if Jimmy was interested in collaborating with David Coverdale. I'm not sure if Brian was interviewed for Barney Hoskyns' book, but he may have been.

13 hours ago, jasonlovesvids said:

 How soon after Karac's  death did jimmy himself come back to England?   And how soon  did Peter come back? I'm not surprised Jimmy would miss the funeral since he was most likely divulging harder into drugs with all that happened within a few days but I'm surprise Peter did not go.    With Jonesey having three kids himself I'm surprised he did not come back to England to be at the funeral. 

The date of Jimmy's return to England remains shrouded in mystery. Some have alleged he was in New Orleans when Robert received the call, while others insist he was still in California. Bill Graham attested to a $25K cash advance at the San Francisco Hilton immediately being provided to a heroin dealer the afternoon prior to the Day on the Green concerts in Oakland, so it's plausible (though speculative) Jimmy was in no condition to travel to New Orleans or anywhere else for a few days. JPJ, his wife and daughters were travelling in a Winnebago and left Oakland soon after the second concert, so it's plausible they were on the road and out of contact at the time Robert returned to England. We know Peter remained in New Orleans to handle postponement and eventual cancellation of the remaining dates. We know Jimmy, JPJ and Peter were not at the funeral but I have always refrained from armchair quarterbacking them or their personal decisions in what was obviously a very tragic and difficult time.   

 

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6 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

I have always refrained from armchair quarterbacking them or their personal decisions in what was obviously a very tragic and difficult time.   

 

And I, for one, am grateful that you do so refrain.  It is so tiresome when people try to guess what was going on in their personal lives, especially when they have themselves, refrained from talking about it themselves.  Thank you.

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10 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

I'm away from my notes at the moment, not that I have many on Brian Goode, who remained very much out of the limelight and by many accounts in way over his head. Off the top of my head, his management began during The Firm era and ended in 1994 after Jimmy joined forces with Bill Curbishley, who was Robert's manager at the time. I do know it was Brian who took the call from Rod McSween in January 1991 to inquire if Jimmy was interested in collaborating with David Coverdale. I'm not sure if Brian was interviewed for Barney Hoskyns' book, but he may have been.

The date of Jimmy's return to England remains shrouded in mystery. Some have alleged he was in New Orleans when Robert received the call, while others insist he was still in California. Bill Graham attested to a $25K cash advance at the San Francisco Hilton immediately being provided to a heroin dealer the afternoon prior to the Day on the Green concerts in Oakland, so it's plausible (though speculative) Jimmy was in no condition to travel to New Orleans or anywhere else for a few days. JPJ, his wife and daughters were travelling in a Winnebago and left Oakland soon after the second concert, so it's plausible they were on the road and out of contact at the time Robert returned to England. We know Peter remained in New Orleans to handle postponement and eventual cancellation of the remaining dates. We know Jimmy, JPJ and Peter were not at the funeral but I have always refrained from armchair quarterbacking them or their personal decisions in what was obviously a very tragic and difficult time.   

 

 How long was it until the next concert day after Oakland?  Just wondering because if JPJ was gone in a Winnebago with his family, when was he do to be at the next show?

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