Zeppelin Mysteries Hosted by Steve A. Jones

[Wolfman]

I think that will be a NO.

Later that evening I explained to Jimmy the miraculous renovations in progress and conveyed David's open invitation to visit. Jimmy was surprised to hear of my interest in that property, and I sensed wistfulness in his comments, as he and Peter had originally purchased the estate in the early 70s with a view towards converting it into a recording site they could share comfortably with their growing families (a similar example would be Rockfield Studios in Wales). However, the degree of neglect, among other more pressing

considerations, led them to sell the property a few years later.

Well from this statement, I take it Steve has met Jimmy and it sound more personal than an average fan speaking to him.

Edited April 20, 2009 by Wolfman

[walterswalk]

Later that evening I explained to Jimmy the miraculous renovations in progress and conveyed David's open invitation to visit. Jimmy was surprised to hear of my interest in that property, and I sensed wistfulness in his comments, as he and Peter had originally purchased the estate in the early 70s with a view towards converting it into a recording site they could share comfortably with their growing families (a similar example would be Rockfield Studios in Wales). However, the degree of neglect, among other more pressing

considerations, led them to sell the property a few years later.

Well from this statement, I take it Steve has met Jimmy and it sound more personal than an average fan speaking to him.

Big difference from knowing him personally and talking with him through a gate.

[Wolfman]

Big difference from knowing him personally and talking with him through a gate.

So Steve's a stalker?

j/k Steve....you the man with the info

[walterswalk]

So Steve's a stalker?

j/k Steve....you the man with the info

Never said he was a stalker but i think you will find i am correct in saying SAJ does not know Jimmy Page on that personal level.

[beatbo]

Never said he was a stalker but i think you will find i am correct in saying SAJ does not know Jimmy Page on that personal level.

so.....are you saying steve is lying? you seem to be certainly insinuating something.

i will say this: this is my favorite thread on this damn forum and sometimes the only reason i log on. many, many people have cast stones or or darker aspersions without anything to back it up. steve hasn't claimed BFF status or entourage membership. it sounds to me like he stated a fact and the manner in which he stated it caused your vomit of sour grapes.

contribute or piss off.

hope this helps!

beat

[SteveAJones]

contribute or piss off.

hope this helps!

"walterswalk" has contributed in the past, particularly in regards to the theft of Jimmy's

tapes. In time he may elect to contribute further. I regret sharing a personal anecdote

here has derailed a thread so many of us enjoy. Back to the mysteries!

[RoundRobin]

As with so many things,

"People who live in glass houses should not throw stones"

Accusers need to produce their own substantiation and reveal their own experience in detail or put up or shut up.

[SteveAJones]

Steve check this out. Though it doesn't have the exact date and I don't know if it will be helpful.

try this

This is very close to, if not the actual "promotional photo" I was thinking of. I note with interest caption says it was taken in Milton Keynes. I'll work on confirmation of Heart

having performed there and when. It appears to be circa '83-'85. The chap on the far

right is wearing a pass of some sort but I can't make out anything on it. Thanks!

[walterswalk]

so.....are you saying steve is lying? you seem to be certainly insinuating something.

i will say this: this is my favorite thread on this damn forum and sometimes the only reason i log on. many, many people have cast stones or or darker aspersions without anything to back it up. steve hasn't claimed BFF status or entourage membership. it sounds to me like he stated a fact and the manner in which he stated it caused your vomit of sour grapes.

contribute or piss off.

hope this helps!

beat

Vomit of sour grapes , me Nawwwwwwwwwww.

Edited April 22, 2009 by walterswalk

[SteveAJones]

The Robert Plant / Jerry Miller Connection

Robert Plant has recorded two songs written by Jerry Miller: '8:05' and 'Naked If I Want To'. During the pre-Zeppelin era, Robert performed a third, 'Hey Grandma'.

Legendary guitarist Jerry Miller loses Led Zeppelin memorabilia in flood

by Arne Nordwall

Examiner (Wichita, WA) February 8, 2009

In the music business, as in other life pursuits, there are always winners and losers. There are innumerable great talents whom, if not for the whims of Chance, would rival the most famous and popular stars.

A Tacoma native son, guitarist Jerry Miller, is one of those. His talent is formidable and his name is spoken in the same breath as greats such as Eric Clapton, Stevie Ray Vaughn, Michael Bloomfield, Peter Green, Wes Montgomery, and many more. This recognition is only apparent, though, when you're speaking to other guitar players or someone with a fairly deep knowledge and love of jazz, blues and rock stylists. His proficiency isn't generally acknowledged nor his fame widespeard. The rewards of a gift like his don't always manifest themselves in bright lights. In a way it's lucky for us here in the area to hear Jerry play from time to time in small friendly joints !

An anecdote that I like to use to illustrate how Jerry's talent is appreciated by other players, is an incident which I was a witness to. Jerry's odyssey through rock stardom includes a time when he was a seminal member of a late sixties band formed in San Francisco called Moby Grape. This band shot loudly into fame and fortune and then whimpered into obscurity as just another of the many mis-managed and ill-fated groups throughout rock history. For a time, as the band was staying in the L.A. Area recording, they hung out with members of Buffalo Springfield and others who would, as we all know now, transition into Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young.

Steve Stills became a friend and fan of Jerry, and as time went on, when he was scheduled to play a gig here in the area, he would invite Jerry and some guests to come to the show. After a CSNY show in the Tacoma Dome in the late nineties we all went backstage as Jerry went to talk with Steve. They chatted for a few minutes about guitars and catching-up small talk, then, as Jerry was walking away, Steve called out to tell him in effect "You know Jerry, you are the best guitar player in the world !"

Many others cite Jerry ( himself, or as a member of Moby Grape) as an influence, including Robert Plant and Jimmy Page of Led Zeppelin; Richard Thompson ( great in his own right, and as a member of the hugely influential Fairport Convention with Sandy Denny); Buddy Miller ( Buddy and Julie Miller, Emmylou Harris, Shawn Colvin), Sam Andrew ( Big Brother and the Holding Company, Janis Joplin).

Jerry was honored by Rolling Stone Magazine a few years ago as number 68 in a list the editors compiled of the " 100 Greatest guitar Players of All Time" ( Richard Thompson made the top 20).

Many things could be said about Jerry's life in the music business, about what could have been, or the recognition he should be entitled to as one of the "greatest" - and some would say he himself has flaws that have restrained him from flourishing, but no one can say that he should have come to the crossing that he now faces.

Jerry had been living in the town of Pacific, WA. for the last couple years. On January 8th 2009, during heavy rain, the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers who controlled the Mud Creek Dam, released too much water from the dam and inadvertantly caused a flash flood downstream. A neighbor's alert to get out was all the advance notice Jerry had before the water came. He was able to gather a few things, including his '59 Gibson L5 guitar , "Beulah" which he ordered from Gibson when he was a teenager in Tacoma based on his love for Wes Montgomery's playing.

In the aftermath of this flood, Jerry Miller has lost just about all that he had left of his long career in the rock music business. He didn't have a lot anyway, but he had been able to collect many objects and memorabilia. Among these items were photos of Jerry with Robert Plant ( who still sings one of Jerry's songs in his solo act from time to time), and also with Jimi Hendrix. Many other signed photos from friends like Steve Stills, as well as recordings and concert posters and all the accumulated bits and pieces of a life were lost or badly damaged by the water. Not to mention the more mundane, but immediate loss of clothing, car and other necessities.

Jerry has had to resort to living in a motel and with accomodating friends, and is struggling with the financial burden of beginning again, and so a couple of benefits have been organized to help him. The first was organized by Jerry's friend Craig Arrowood of Uncle Sams' American Bar and Grill in Spanaway, WA, and will have already taken place by the time you read this.

The next benefit event will be at The Swiss in Tacoma on March 8th and details of that show are still being worked out, but there will no doubt be many local bands and entertainers in attendance. Jerry Miller is loved in Tacoma, as only a native son can.

More details about the benefit as well as how you can help Jerry with donations are available on his website : jerrymillerband.com

Edited April 22, 2009 by SteveAJones

[SteveAJones]

Hi Steve!

Here's some newer questions for you.

1.) Since the last couple of pages in this thread deal with the necklace, didn't Chris Farlowe own / or still own a WWII memorabilia store? If so, when did Chris open / purchase the store? Perhaps some of Jimmy's articles of clothing / jewelry was purchased from Chris' store?

Chris apparently became involved in selling World War II memorabilia from a stall towards

end of the 60s when his music career waned. Ultimately, he opened an antique furniture store in his hometown of Islington in 1972 and it remained a going concern until he sold it and left for the USA in 1983. Upon his return to Islington he apparently reopened a

showroom/workshop.

This article includes some additional comments from Chris:

Adolf Hitler: my hunt for his furniture

The Independent (London) Dec 3, 2000

by Imre Karacs in Berlin

KLAUS BEETZ is a very nice man who works for the German Finance Ministry and needs help shifting some period furniture. He has tried the German Historical Museum in Berlin, but they said no, as did all the provincial museums he has approached. So, can anybody out there spare room for Adolf Hitler's desk, his conference table, a sideboard and a few chairs?

They are unwanted gifts. The furnishings of the "Second Reichskanzelei" in Berchtesgaden, Hitler's retreat in the Bavarian Alps, fell into the hands of the US army at the end of the Second World War. In 1996, the US government wanted to show its magnanimity by handing some of the loot back to Germany. "It was a completely new situation," Mr Beetz recalls. "We said, `My God, what are we going to do with all this stuff?'"

Four years on, the Independent on Sunday can reveal the answer: not a great deal. There are plenty of collectors of Hitler memorabilia abroad who would love to give the furniture a home, even if German museums do not want it, but the German government would commit political suicide if it was seen to be making money this way. Why not simply burn the stuff? No chance: an international treaty forbids it.

I contacted Chris Farlowe, who was highly excited to learn of my discovery. A 1960s pop star whose biggest hit was Out of Time, he used to run a shop selling Third Reich memorabilia in Islington, north London. "It's got to go into the right auctions," Mr Farlowe said. "It's got to go to England. You're talking about tens of thousands of pounds."

Auction houses such as Sotheby's told me they would not deal in the personal belongings of Hitler or his henchmen, and the law forbids their sale in Germany or France, but that was no problem for Mr Farlowe. "If you could put it into a van, you could get it across the Channel, no hassle," he advised. "I could put you in touch with a really rich friend who could sell it, no trouble. He's got a chair from the Reich Chancellery. It's lovely, it's got a great big eagle and swastika on the back. Has yours got that?"

Sorry Chris, no: "If I didn't say that the chairs came from the Reichskanzelei, then they would be completely worthless," said Mr Beetz. The truth is that although Hitler fancied himself as an artist, he had no taste. The sad collection of his furniture, tucked away in the side rooms of a decaying conference centre in east Berlin, looks like the pickings of a house-clearance merchant in a not particularly prosperous district. The table, chairs and leather armchairs were designed to fit in with the Nazi architectural concept of Berchtesgaden, as laid down by Albert Speer. The result is bastardised Bauhaus - neo-classical simplicity smothered by rustic upholstery.

I tracked down Adolf's belongings to the centre, now an annexe of the "Federal Agency for Radiation Protection", at the end of a bumpy dirt track among allotments in east Berlin. I needed written permission from the Finance Ministry to view what the German public is not allowed to see.

Mr Beetz met me on the steps of the Communist-era building, all mock marble and futuristic light fittings straight out of a low- budget science fiction movie. Its inaccessibility and lack of modern facilities means it is now no use for anything but storage. The main hall floor was covered with a pile of Persian carpets. Experts from all kinds of museums came and went, looking for anything useful for their exhibits, but no one bothered with the apparent junk in two rooms off one of the corridors. The curtains were drawn, the heat turned down.

Not all of the furniture is in mint condition. The desk in the second room still bears a label of its previous owners. "This item is the property of the United States and is reportable under the Potsdam Agreement," it states. "Catalogue number 1995-65.72".

For 50 years the Americans used Berchtesgaden as an officers' club. Then some of the furniture was packed off to Wash- ington, only to be sent back to the supposedly grateful German people. What they didn't get ended up at the offices of the US Chief of Staff in Heidelberg. They are holding on to a few paintings and the coffee table around which the Fuhrer met Neville Chamberlain. And during the Kosovo campaign they were still using the original globe on which Hitler looked up the countries he was about to invade. It might explain how the Americans ended up bombing the Chinese embassy in Belgrade by mistake.

The US period is all too evident on the furniture now in Berlin. "The Americans were rather disrespectful," Mr Beetz said indignantly. "Look at those cigarette burns. Hitler, of course, was a non- smoker." Yet there they are, six little holes piercing the desk's imitation leather covering. Someone has also bolted a telephone socket onto the side of the precious furniture.

But it is unlikely that a demand for reparations will be winging its way to Washington. The German government dare not exhibit this piece of history, lest it should unwittingly create a shrine to Nazism. No- where in Germany can personal items belonging to leaders of the Third Reich be seen.

What about selling it off? Germany's Holocaust Foundation is nearly DM1bn (over pounds 300m) short of what is needed to pay off former slave workers. A nice idea, Mr Beetz concedes, but impracticable. "I think - and please make clear this is my personal opinion, not government policy - that the ideological and political damage would be considerably greater than the few marks we would make out of it."

Mr Beetz, in any case, is not interested in this kind of solution, not yet. "Time heals," he said. "Maybe in 10 years we'll see things differently."

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I can't yet say for certain if Jimmy acquired any military items from Chris, but Jimmy was

known to wear the uniform of an American Union Soldier whilst a member of The Yardbirds, amongst other items. The feature belows examines the phenomena closer.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Rock Military Style – Motivations Behind the Military Look of 1960s Rock Musicians

v/Michael A. Langkjær, Ph.d., Saxo Instituttet og CTR/Danmarks Grundforskningsfonds Center for Tekstilforskning

Tid: Fredag den 12. oktober kl. 14-15.30. Foredrag på engelsk

Sted: CTR, lokale 16.2.7, SAXO-Instituttet, KUA (se kort på www.hum.ku.dk)

Rock Military Style – Motivations Behind the Military Look of 1960s Rock Musicians

v/Michael A. Langkjær, Ph.d., Saxo Instituttet og CTR/Centre for Textile Research

The history of rock presents us with innumerable iconic images of stars, who, like Jimi Hendrix, Mick Jagger and not least, the Beatles, performed in military uniforms in the mid to late 1960s. It has been presumed that this was done to satirize the values of the 'Establishment' or as a protest against the Vietnam War; a symbol was being transgressed in order to make a social or political statement. But what was being targeted? Was it the military, the Establishment, imperialism, masculinity? Or was it the conformity of the mainstream – or even the commercialized style of rock performances? Was it all just transgression or might it have involved something else? And where did the craze for uniforms originate? In Pop/Mod 'Swinging London' or in Hippie San Francisco? Did rock stars influence their fans or was it the other way around? Currents and cross-currents of the Pop/Mod aesthetics of Britain, black 'stylin' in the USA and the 'peacock revolution' in male fashion converged with the 1960s second hand, anti-fashion nostalgia for Empire, Victoriana and Edwardiana (as seen in the cinema, on television and the 'Lord Kitchener chic' of London's Carnaby Street), along with the contemporary bent towards parody, satire and 'camp' and with possible influences from Brechtian 'estrangement' and Situationist détournement. A number of trendsetting rock musicians were alumni of the art colleges of Britain, having been taught the montage aesthetics of Pop artists such as Richard Hamilton and Peter Blake. The antiwar Yippie activist Jerry Rubin's appearance in an American Revolutionary War uniform before the House Un-American Activities Committee (HUAC) in 1966 is a possible link to the more overtly transgressive use of uniforms among youth in the late sixties. As opposed to Jimi Hendrix's own protestation, that by his wearing a hussar jacket rather than letting it moulder in a closet, he was in fact honouring the dead soldier to whom that jacket once belonged. Although the mainstream did look upon such re-use of military uniforms as a debasement, it can hardly have been what the rock performers felt. Motivations behind the military look of 1960's rock musicians have been as diverse as the rock musicians themselves.

Edited April 22, 2009 by SteveAJones

[SteveAJones]

...continuing on with Robert's original inquiries, here are two examples of 1980 Led Zeppelin tour passes which feature the emblem of promoter Harvey Goldsmith. Authenticity very much in doubt given no direct connection between the tour and Goldsmith has been confirmed. How 'bout a little help here, Harvey?

Passes courtesy of Steve A. Jones Archive

Edited April 22, 2009 by SteveAJones

[Sems Fir]

...continuing on with Robert's original inquiries, here are two examples of 1980 Led Zeppelin tour passes which feature the emblem of promoter Harvey Goldsmith. Authenticity very much in doubt given no direct connection between the tour and Goldsmith has been confirmed. How 'bout a little help here, Harvey?

Passes courtesy of Steve A. Jones Archive

Hi Steve!

I sent an inquiry to attempt to obtain more information to a question box on Harvey Goldsmith's site. I have yet to hear a response. I may try one other email address I have located. Thanks so much for posting the images of the passes you have in your collection. For the curious readers of this amazing thread here's an image of the questionable '80 tour laminated pass I own:

Robert

P.S. I have more questions set to be posted Steve! Have to keep you busy in this fishbowl.

[JimmyPageZoSo56]

SteveAJones, this is probably in here somewhere, but I don't feel like going through 121 pages to find it. Whats with the album cover on Early Days? Why are they wearing Apollo astronaut suits? What are the original pictures from?

[Knebby]

so.....are you saying steve is lying? you seem to be certainly insinuating something.

i will say this: this is my favorite thread on this damn forum and sometimes the only reason i log on. many, many people have cast stones or or darker aspersions without anything to back it up. steve hasn't claimed BFF status or entourage membership. it sounds to me like he stated a fact and the manner in which he stated it caused your vomit of sour grapes.

contribute or piss off.

hope this helps!

beat

OMG that is hilarious. The guy you are being so rude to has had more contact with Page and Plant than SAJ has had wet dreams about them - whatsmore he is absolutely dead on.

Now, back to the mysteries of the thread - and perhaps ask yourself why the thread you love so much would even exist if Steve knew Jimmy on a "personal" level - he'd just need to directly ask Jimmy for all the answers then, surely?

[Knebby]

...continuing on with Robert's original inquiries, here are two examples of 1980 Led Zeppelin tour passes which feature the emblem of promoter Harvey Goldsmith. Authenticity very much in doubt given no direct connection between the tour and Goldsmith has been confirmed. How 'bout a little help here, Harvey?

Passes courtesy of Steve A. Jones Archive

I really don't understand this claim. Harvey Goldsmith set up the whole 1980 tour through his Umbrella Productions and actually travelled with the band for most if not all of it. This page from Dave Lewis' "Tight But Loose" issue 5 shows him checking into their hotel in Cologne

Dave also recounts a lovely memory of Ahmet Ertegun asking Harvey for a match so he could hold it up like the sea of fans.

Edited April 22, 2009 by Knebby

[SteveAJones]

Ask yourself why the thread you love so much would even exist if Steve knew Jimmy on a "personal" level - he'd just need to directly ask Jimmy for all the answers then, surely?

Well, Frank Sinatra explained this best when he said "a friend in need...is a pest".

[SteveAJones]

I really don't understand this claim. Harvey Goldsmith set up the whole 1980 tour through his Umbrella Productions and actually travelled with the band for most if not all of it. This page from Dave Lewis' "Tight But Loose" issue 5 shows him checking into their hotel in Cologne

Dave also recounts a lovely memory of Ahmet Ertegun asking Harvey for a match so he could hold it up like the sea of fans.

Not so much a claim as an initial starting point. You've provided additional references

to substantiate there certainly is a direct connection, and move the focus solely upon

authenticity of the passes themselves. I have every fanzine, book and periodical Dave

has ever published, but you know how it goes - many years can pass since last having

something in particular that holds the answer. I was inclined to contact him concerning

Robert's inquiry but the written work presented above speaks for itself. Collaboration is

the key!

[Knebby]

Well, Frank Sinatra explained this best when he said "a friend in need...is a pest".

Nice catch - and I actually do understand that point - but, well, admiiting you don't know Jimmy on a personal level wouldn't make this thread any less interesting - or you any less of a fan.

[Knebby]

Not so much a claim as an initial starting point. You've provided additional references

to substantiate there certainly is a direct connection, and move the focus solely upon

authenticity of the passes themselves. I have every fanzine, book and periodical Dave

has ever published, but you know how it goes - many years can pass since last having

something in particular that holds the answer. I was inclined to contact him concerning

Robert's inquiry but the written work presented above speaks for itself. Collaboration is

the key!

If it helps they look exactly like the passes Dave has published in his 1980 tour stories.

You'll also find lots of references to Harvey when you re-read them.

Edited April 22, 2009 by Knebby

[SteveAJones]

SteveAJones, this is probably in here somewhere, but I don't feel like going through 121 pages to find it. Whats with the album cover on Early Days? Why are they wearing Apollo astronaut suits? What are the original pictures from?

Just prior to release, Atlantic changed the title from "Led Zeppelin - Blast Off!' to 'Led Zeppelin - Early Days & Latter Days'. However, the original album graphics remained unchanged. The album credits should confirm where the actual images came from. The

point of the release was to put a couple best of compilations in the marketplace to appeal to a new generation of listeners, thereby stimulating back catalog sales. When

'Mothership' was released, 'Early Days & Latter Days' were phased out.

Interestingly enough, Atlantic did something similar the year before with Page/Plant's 'Walking Into Clarksdale' album, having changed it's original title prior to release from 'Most High' but keeping the original "angelic theme" album graphics.

[SteveAJones]

Nice catch - and I actually do understand that point - but, well, admitting you don't know Jimmy on a personal level wouldn't make this thread any less interesting - or you any less of a fan.

Earlier in this thread you posted I treat people's graves as tourist sites and pretend I'm Jimmy Page so I'm just not inclined to encourage discussion of personal affairs further.

Contrary to posts others have made, I've never claimed to be an "expert" or an "insider", whomever I am or am not.

When this you see, remember me

and bear me in your mind

Let all the world say what they may,

speak of me as you find

[SteveAJones]

If it helps they look exactly like the passes Dave has published in his 1980 tour stories.

You'll also find lots of references to Harvey when you re-read them.

Thanks so much. I absolutely will later this week. 'The Final Acclaim' is still top-notch!

[Knebby]

Surely a major factor is you refuse to deny it either - which would end all such speculative posts.

And I stand by what I said - having photos taken at someone's grave is treating it as a tourist site, and you HAVE claimed to be the figure in your avavtar - and post Jimmy's addresses etc as your location. I'm afraid you can't then blame ME for pointing this out.

Go figure.

*i prefer the fanzines to the books *

Edited April 22, 2009 by Knebby

[walterswalk]

Surely a major factor is you refuse to deny it either - which would end all such speculative posts.

And I stand by what I said - having photos taken at someone's grave is treating it as a tourist site, and you HAVE claimed to be the figure in your avavtar - and post Jimmy's addresses etc as your location. I'm afraid you can't then blame ME for pointing this out.

Go figure.

*i prefer the fanzines to the books *

Come on Steve a simple yes or no, you can do it.

Edited April 22, 2009 by walterswalk