Wolfman Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Just watched the fantastic documentary, "Beware Mr. Baker" and Ginger basically trashes Bonzo. "Bonham had technique but he couldn't swing a sack of shit. The same with Moonie. If they were alive today, ask them." Then they cut to Eric Clapton and he scoffs at the idea of Bonzo/ Moonie being compared to Ginger because he claims Baker is a composer and was a fully harmonic musician. The thing I found interesting was he considers himself a jazz drummer and that at one point in his life, he used to shoot up a mix of heroin, cocaine, and LSD. He's totally insane! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Cream has to be the most pompous group of all-time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redirtuo Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 I heard Baker once puked on his drum kit in concert and kept beat so maybe that's what Clapton meant by being fully harmonic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melcórë Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 (edited) Jazz musicians certainly also used those drugs...maybe not the cocktail of them. Baker being...unapologetic about his feelings toward Bonham and Moon is not news -- he's expressed similar sentiments in the past. I would argue that it boils down (sadly) to some sense of jealousy. Cream were great, but...Zeppelin, and even The Who, were different animals altogether, and achieved greater levels of monetary success and accolades than Cream ever has. Edited July 25, 2013 by Melcórë Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagesbow Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magerogue Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 I always find funny how basicaly every contemporary musician trashes Zeppelin because of their obvious musical superiority and larger fan base. Pete Townshend says the same things as Ginger Baker, hates the music and likes them as people... They just can't get past their jealousy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melcórë Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 That...video is weird. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gstritzi Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 BAKER IS A IDIOTJust watched the fantastic documentary, "Beware Mr. Baker" and Ginger basically trashes Bonzo. "Bonham had technique but he couldn't swing a sack of shit. The same with Moonie. If they were alive today, ask them." Then they cut to Eric Clapton and he scoffs at the idea of Bonzo/ Moonie being compared to Ginger because he claims Baker is a composer and was a fully harmonic musician. The thing I found interesting was he considers himself a jazz drummer and that at one point in his life, he used to shoot up a mix of heroin, cocaine, and LSD. He's totally insane! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperDave Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 That was quite bizarre and so is Baker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Drug wreckage. A man with such poor judgement and he expects anyone to care about his opinions about Bonham and Moon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayougal65 Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Just watched the fantastic documentary, "Beware Mr. Baker" and Ginger basically trashes Bonzo. "Bonham had technique but he couldn't swing a sack of shit. The same with Moonie. If they were alive today, ask them." Then they cut to Eric Clapton and he scoffs at the idea of Bonzo/ Moonie being compared to Ginger because he claims Baker is a composer and was a fully harmonic musician. The thing I found interesting was he considers himself a jazz drummer and that at one point in his life, he used to shoot up a mix of heroin, cocaine, and LSD. He's totally insane! I have also watched the documentary; and it is just a sad, sad state the violent paranoia and psychosis that haunts and embodies Ginger Baker. I believe he is persona non grata on several continents! Sad, just sad! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Duck Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 I have also watched the documentary; and it is just a sad, sad state the violent paranoia and psychosis that haunts and embodies Ginger Baker. I believe he is persona non grata on several continents! Sad, just sad! This. He was a talented drummer and musician in his day, but he has always come across as a rather unpleasant man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DropDown Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 (edited) I was actually entertaining the thought of going to see him at Ronnie Scott's next month to see what the man behind the movie hype was all about ( I still haven't seen it yet). Given his comments about Bonham and Moon I'll pass. He needs to get over himself, pronto. Envy will hurt itself. Edited for grammar. Edited July 25, 2013 by DropDown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the chase Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Watching that clip makes it hard for me to feel anything but pity. I think he'd rather be disliked than pitied ... DVR is qued up to record it tonight on SHOWTIME. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deborah J Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 ^^ I watched it on Showtime. Really sad because he was a talented drummer, but he just seems fried! His redeeming quality was the love for his animals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottedplant Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 I love Cream's music; never liked Ginger Baker. He was a good drummer - not a really great drummer like Bonzo. Baker knows that, I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeppy668 Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 He's been the same person for 40 years now: extremely deranged and manic while being an extremely gifted percussionist. I agree with Clapton's description of Baker's playing, even if I disagree with his opinion of Bonham and Moon. And in all fairness, without Cream and their tremendous influence, we likely wouldn't have had the Jimi Hendrix Experience, Black Sabbath and Led Zeppelin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeppy668 Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 (edited) "People hadn't really taken much notice of drums before Krupa. And Ginger Baker was responsible for the same thing in rock. Rock music had been around for a few years before Baker, but he was the first to come out with this 'new' attitude-that a drummer could be a forward musician in a rock band, and not something that was stuck in the background and forgotten about. I don't think anyone can ever put Ginger Baker down. Of course, everyone has their own idea of when Baker was at this peak. I thought he fantastic when he played with the Graham Bond Organization. It's a pity American audiences didn't see that band, because it really was a fantastic group-Ginger Bajer, Jack Bruce and Graham Bond. I think Baker was really more into jazz than rock. He does play with a jazz influence. He's always doing things in 5/4 and 3/4 tempos. Unfortunately he's always been a very weird sort of bloke. You can't really get to know him...he just won't allow it. Ginger's thing as a drummer is that he was always himself." - John Bonham Edited July 26, 2013 by zeppy668 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperDave Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 Time for him to let this stuff go and get with it. Seems it's all jealousy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melcórë Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 And in all fairness, without Cream and their tremendous influence, we likely wouldn't have had the Jimi Hendrix Experience, Black Sabbath and Led Zeppelin. Not quite -- Cream's debut single and album were released in December 1966; The Jimi Hendrix Experience had already been formed at that point, and recorded their debut single ("Hey Joe"/"Stone Free") in October. The other musicians would have gone places irrespective of the influence of Cream on their development, which I find negligible at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperDave Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 Not quite -- Cream's debut single and album were released in December 1966; The Jimi Hendrix Experience had already been formed at that point, and recorded their debut single ("Hey Joe"/"Stone Free") in October. The other musicians would have gone places irrespective of the influence of Cream on their development, which I find negligible at best. Definitely agree with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CIAFTOG Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 I think Cream deserves its place in the pantheon of 60's British rock groups. Each member was a great musician and to dismiss their influence is probably easy this many years later, and it takes a more knowledgable person than me to really make the case for them, but I think the only thing standing between them and the Stones, Who, etc., is longevity. Baker is clearly a misanthrope but if it hadn't been for this documentary I would not have known that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunkyPhantom Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 (edited) i don't believe Bonzo had words like this for any of his contemporaries did he? Such a shame that Baker lacks a brain, but I suppose not all musicians are nice people. Edited July 26, 2013 by FunkyPhantom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayougal65 Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 ^^ I watched it on Showtime. Really sad because he was a talented drummer, but he just seems fried! His redeeming quality was the love for his animals. I know, his love of polo and its ponies was almost shocking in the context of the rest of his life! A very complex, but yet sad man, Mr. Baker is! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeppy668 Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 Not quite -- Cream's debut single and album were released in December 1966; The Jimi Hendrix Experience had already been formed at that point, and recorded their debut single ("Hey Joe"/"Stone Free") in October. The other musicians would have gone places irrespective of the influence of Cream on their development, which I find negligible at best. Right to clarify on the dates but regardless, Cream influenced everyone during that time period, including The Experience. Both trios pushed each other into directions that saw different takes on the emerging psychedelic scene. Speaking of drummers here, Mitch Mitchell is still my all time favorite. The guy had incredible technique: loose, energetic, jazzy and eruptive. He's definitely in the Big 4 with Bonzo, Moon and Ginger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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