The later albums?

[TheMadIrishman]

Welcome to the Later albums topic session . Here we discuss the later, less tolerable Led-Zeppelin that puts that sour taste on our zeppelin palettes. Try to stay on topic and enjoy! 

[John M]

I enjoy Presence and Out Door as much as any of the others.  Yes they are different, but every Zeppelin album is different from the others.  I think Presence is one of their best, and Out Door is amazing in so many ways.  To each his own I guess.

[Boleskinner]

I would love to hear a version of Carouselambra with Jonsey's cheesy keyboard sounds taken out and him playing a new keyboard sound and motif in its place.

Would be very interesting.

The new mix on the companion discs was already clearer and an improvement, and I've heard a guitar-heavy rehearsal version which is even better.

The whole ITTOD album could do with a remix to remove the mudiness and bring out the vocals and guitars in some songs. In the Evening for example.

Might be sacrilege, but John Lennon's Imagine suffered from the same muddiness and a remix and remaster made it sound amazing.

[Box of Jimmy's]

It was very respctful of Jones, Plant and Bonham to play with Jimmy on his first solo LP (Presence) as it was for the three to play on Plants first solo effort, ITTOD.  Seriously, I love them all, though ITTOD was clearly moving in to the changing music scene. Pages abscence on that effort is pretty evident.

[Strider]

First of all, the later albums do not put a "sour taste" on my palate. So I will not be joining your whinge-fest.

Secondly, there are already plenty of discussion threads about "Presence" and "In Through the Out Door" and "Coda", where you can weigh in with your thoughts.

[IpMan]

7 minutes ago, Strider said:

First of all, the later albums do not put a "sour taste" on my palate. So I will not be joining your whinge-fest.

Secondly, there are already plenty of discussion threads about "Presence" and "In Through the Out Door" and "Coda", where you can weigh in with your thoughts.

^+1

[the chase]

3 hours ago, Boleskinner said:

I would love to hear a version of Carouselambra with Jonsey's cheesy keyboard sounds taken out and him playing a new keyboard sound and motif in its place.

Would be very interesting.

The new mix on the companion discs was already clearer and an improvement, and I've heard a guitar-heavy rehearsal version which is even better.

The whole ITTOD album could do with a remix to remove the mudiness and bring out the vocals and guitars in some songs. In the Evening for example.

Might be sacrilege, but John Lennon's Imagine suffered from the same muddiness and a remix and remaster made it sound amazing.

Those "cheesy" keyboard sounds came from a Yamaha GX-1 that went for about $60,000 new in 1978.. It was the state of the art. To me they might sound dated but not cheesy. I do prefer the Mellotron.. John Paul Jones later sold his GX-1 to Keith Emerson .. who already owned 2 of them. 

Edited June 8, 2017 by the chase

[JohnOsbourne]

Presence is a truly great album, and certainly the end of an era.  ITTOD is awful, I just cannot abide the change of style.  (Yes, I know it incorporates elements that had always been in Zep's music, but it signaled a change of direction for the 80's, and not for the better IMO.)

[the chase]

I don't think ITTOD was a sign of things to come. Every Zeppelin album was different. 

[IpMan]

1 hour ago, JohnOsbourne said:

Presence is a truly great album, and certainly the end of an era.  ITTOD is awful, I just cannot abide the change of style.  (Yes, I know it incorporates elements that had always been in Zep's music, but it signaled a change of direction for the 80's, and not for the better IMO.)

But of course, next stop for Zep in the 80's...keytars and synth drums. They would have sounded like Technical Ecstasy Sabbath after getting anal probed by the Thompson Twins.

Um, no. If Bonzo would have lived I still hold they would have broken up after the 81' leg of the NA tour. Robert was done.

[Mook]

I love Presence, I think it's a great album & in some ways it's Bonham's best studio performance. ITTOD has its moments but it's not one I listen to very often, I agree with the points above about the keyboards dating badly.

[chillumpuffer]

Presence is a fantastic album. I first heard Achilles on Alan Freeman's Saturday Rock show before it was released and loved it ever since. I have a once played original vinyl of In Through The Out Door - says it all really.

[Boleskinner]

10 hours ago, the chase said:

Those "cheesy" keyboard sounds came from a Yamaha GX-1 that went for about $60,000 new in 1978.. It was the state of the art. To me they might sound dated but not cheesy. I do prefer the Mellotron.. John Paul Jones later sold his GX-1 to Keith Emerson .. who already owned 2 of them. 

I don't care if it cost one million British pounds, or if Keith Emerson owned 50, the sound and rhythm Jonesy choose to use on Carouselambra reeked of blue-veined Stilton.

Bowie and plenty of other artists used synths in the late 70s.

Some of those tracks sound a bit dated now, but not cheesy like Carouselambra.

Edited June 8, 2017 by Boleskinner

[Stryder1978]

I thought The Doors had the market on "cheesy" keyboard sounds?

[Dallas Knebs]

Using the search function is usually worthwhile on a forum...

I still don't know what to make of the last three albums.

CODA bothers me some, the artwork just really made me cringe and wonder what is that. Some good music on the 3 LPs to be sure. I'm Gonna Crawl is one of my favorite tunes, would rather have heard it done like SIBLY. But there I go...

Overall, I played side2 of LZII and side 2 of the second LP on TSRTS the most out of my LZ LPs. 

Jones unit did go to Emerson who sold it to Zimmer who sold it to a privateer in 2003.  The unit does have a whang to its sound- it just does. And the early units were known to make a noise that could only be fixed by turning it off then back on. You can't put a Steinway in a box nor an orchestra. I have the most recent remasters on vinyl and they are IMHO superb. Most of the mud gone- good or bad.

A few pics below- I do not know if the handwriting is Andy's or not.

[The Rover 75]

I agree that ITTOD is awful, I thought Presence was very good, Coda is what it is.

[JTM]

1 hour ago, Stryder1978 said:

I thought The Doors had the market on "cheesy" keyboard sounds?

Not heard "Chris Robinson Brotherhood" then.....

 

[irondirigible]

Presence contains Achilles Last Stand, which I hear many people say is one of their all time favourite LZ tracks.  It's not in my top 5 or even top 10, but Its still great

[IpMan]

Claiming ITTOD has cheesy keyboards, 38 years after it's release is a bit disingenuous is it not. I do not recall anyone in 79' upon the albums release saying, "man, those are some cheesy keys on that record." The reason being that we cannot look into the future. The sound on the album was cutting edge at the time and though people may not have liked the album due to the direction of the music, or because of the overt use of keyboards, nobody said the keyboard sound itself was cheesy. It is kinda like people pulling out pictures from the 80's where the guys are wearing parachute pants, ballet slippers, and Frankie Say's oversized t-shirts, and the girls with hair three stories high, pastel skirts, and football player sized shoulder pad jackets and going, "Ugh...what were we THINKING!!!" Such an idiotic statement as we can only be products of our time. We can look back, but we cannot see the future.

Just as in 30 years people will look back on 2017 and say, "Ugh...that guitar track sounds way over-driven and that piano...what were we THINKING???"

[Mook]

1 minute ago, IpMan said:

Claiming ITTOD has cheesy keyboards, 38 years after it's release is a bit disingenuous is it not. I do not recall anyone in 79' upon the albums release saying, "man, those are some cheesy keys on that record." The reason being that we cannot look into the future. The sound on the album was cutting edge at the time and though people may not have liked the album due to the direction of the music, or because of the overt use of keyboards, nobody said the keyboard sound itself was cheesy. It is kinda like people pulling out pictures from the 80's where the guys are wearing parachute pants, ballet slippers, and Frankie Say's oversized t-shirts, and the girls with hair three stories high, pastel skirts, and football player sized shoulder pad jackets and going, "Ugh...what were we THINKING!!!" Such an idiotic statement as we can only be products of our time. We can look back, but we cannot see the future.

Just as in 30 years people will look back on 2017 and say, "Ugh...that guitar track sounds way over-driven and that piano...what were we THINKING???"

Some things sound timeless however, like a piano, a Hammond organ or a Fender Rhodes.

The synth used on ITTOD sounds very 'of its time'. Whether that means it's cheesy or not is up to the listener I suppose.

[IpMan]

6 minutes ago, Mook said:

Some things sound timeless however, like a piano, a Hammond organ or a Fender Rhodes.

The synth used on ITTOD sounds very 'of its time'. Whether that means it's cheesy or not is up to the listener I suppose.

All I am saying is that to contemporary ears, the keyboards do sound cheesy to most (including me), but in 1979 nobody thought so as there was no point of comparison and that keyboard sound was both everywhere and was very, very popular.

[the chase]

43 minutes ago, Mook said:

Some things sound timeless however, like a piano, a Hammond organ or a Fender Rhodes.

The synth used on ITTOD sounds very 'of its time'. Whether that means it's cheesy or not is up to the listener I suppose.

I agree.. That is why I called them "dated" instead of cheesy. . 

[blindwillie127]

There's far too much hate for ITTOD. It kinda makes sense for this band to follow up Presence (no keyboards) with ITTOD (keys on every track). Zeppelin never repeated themselves on record, that in itself, is a very very rare thing. For Led Zeppelin, ITTOD was a shit record, anybody else would have killed for a shit record like that. I'm sure it sold well beyond Presence...easily. 

[the chase]

5 hours ago, Boleskinner said:

I don't care if it cost one million British pounds, or if Keith Emerson owned 50, the sound and rhythm Jonesy choose to use on Carouselambra reeked of blue-veined Stilton.

Bowie and plenty of other artists used synths in the late 70s.

Some of those tracks sound a bit dated now, but not cheesy like Carouselambra.

My point was Jones must have had his fill of it if he sold it to Keith Emerson.. I doubt he needed the money. Cheesy or dated are both opinions.. Carouselambra is what it is, love it or hate it. I seriously doubt JPJ would ever be bothered to replace his original tracks though.. 

[chef free]

I've been hooked on LZ since 1972.  I have all the original records, the CDs, the cube set remasters and the new remasters.  The albums I listen to the most these days are PG, Presence, and ITTOD.

Edited June 8, 2017 by chef free