Jimmy Page confirms 2018 release(s)

[the-ocean87]

Let's hope they improved the bass sound on "HTWWW", at least.  And let the drums sound more naturally, not "Shirley-like".

[Brigante]

1 hour ago, the-ocean87 said:

let the drums sound more naturally, not "Shirley-like".

Absolutely. Bonzo is the very last drummer who should have been subjected to Shirley's lifeless, airless, flat, dead drum sound.
I know Jimmy must've signed off on the mixes, but I've never been able to work out why - Bonham's drum sound was such a key part of Zeppelin's sound
and one of the things that Jimmy was most proud of as a producer.
What Shirley did to Bonzo's drums last time round really detracted from all of that and I remember being puzzled that Jimmy had approved it.
Glad to hear that Shirley's not getting another crack at it.

[LedElvis75]

11 hours ago, porgie66 said:

😖 If this is truly it, what a let down. 

Uhh, yeah. 

[Adam Ryan watson]

Shirley said something ridiculous like I  made Bonham s drumming  sound tighter or something to that effect. Bonham s drum sound on the 1972 u.s  audience tapes is outstanding   such a huge sound.

[Adam Ryan watson]

The band's 50th anniversary campaign is officially starting in September so it's safe to say this is not the only release we are getting. If this was it we would not be getting hwww untill September.  Jimmy said unheard zeppelin is coming out and there is no bonus tracks on the remaster . I think it's a safe bet that this is just a continuation of the catalogue remeasters and not part of the 50th anniversary celebration.

[LedElvis75]

8 minutes ago, Adam Ryan watson said:

The band's 50th anniversary campaign is officially starting in September so it's safe to say this is not the only release we are getting. If this was it we would not be getting hwww untill September.  Jimmy said unheard zeppelin is coming out and there is no bonus tracks on the remaster . I think it's a safe bet that this is just a continuation of the catalogue remeasters and not part of the 50th anniversary celebration.

That is true, but boy, wouldn't it have been nice to add TY to this HTWWW reissue?  That is just killer and probably my 2nd favorite version of that song ever (8/31/71 being #1).

[ZepHead315]

12 hours ago, porgie66 said:

😖 If this is truly it, what a let down. 

It isn't. As others have pointed out, this isn't even the start of the 50th anniversary celebration. That's due to begin in September. This is supposed to be a continuation/end of the remasters/reissue campaign. Plus it doesn't mesh with Jimmy's claim that there will be Zeppelin music that people "haven't heard". Of course, that could be just this year's equivalent of "I'll be touring and playing later this year", but based on everything else (the 50th anniversary coming up, the "series of high-profile events", and hints about upcoming announcements), I'm not buying it.

[76229]

1 hour ago, LedElvis75 said:

That is true, but boy, wouldn't it have been nice to add TY to this HTWWW reissue?  That is just killer and probably my 2nd favorite version of that song ever (8/31/71 being #1).

Looks like there's been a subtraction rather than addition; someone on the Steve Hoffman Forum said the running time of Whole Lotta Love implies Hello Marylou has been cut from the medley

[LedElvis75]

12 minutes ago, 76229 said:

Looks like there's been a subtraction rather than addition; someone on the Steve Hoffman Forum said the running time of Whole Lotta Love implies Hello Marylou has been cut from the medley

Saw that over at The Hotel.  Yuk.

[tmtomh]

13 hours ago, porgie66 said:

Agreed on the Blu- ray. WTF with the vinyl?? It should be no more than $100 for 4 LPs. 

Yeah, I just don't know. $99 for the vinyl does sound much more "right" than $125 or $129 or whatever it is.

[Adam Ryan watson]

I hope hello Mary Lou has not been cut it's my favorite part of the medley next to the go ing down slow section

[SymphonyX]

13 hours ago, porgie66 said:

Agreed on the Blu- ray. WTF with the vinyl?? It should be no more than $100 for 4 LPs. 

To make things worst people are going to be getting bent and warped damaged records from Amazon.  Last few years I've been hearing this common complaint from all sorts of people

[porgie66]

1 hour ago, LedElvis75 said:

Saw that over at The Hotel.  Yuk.

 

1 hour ago, 76229 said:

Looks like there's been a subtraction rather than addition; someone on the Steve Hoffman Forum said the running time of Whole Lotta Love implies Hello Marylou has been cut from the medley

 

[the-ocean87]

2 hours ago, 76229 said:

Looks like there's been a subtraction rather than addition; someone on the Steve Hoffman Forum said the running time of Whole Lotta Love implies Hello Marylou has been cut from the medley

If that is true than they are greedy SOBs.

[Strider]

9 hours ago, the-ocean87 said:

Let's hope they improved the bass sound on "HTWWW", at least.  And let the drums sound more naturally, not "Shirley-like".

 

4 hours ago, Adam Ryan watson said:

Shirley said something ridiculous like I  made Bonham s drumming  sound tighter or something to that effect. Bonham s drum sound on the 1972 u.s  audience tapes is outstanding   such a huge sound.

Kevin Shirley is persona non grata as far as I'm concerned. He should never be allowed to work on a Led Zeppelin project again. Not just for what he did to the sound of HTWWW (when the audience tape sounds more natural than the official release you know you've fucked up), but also because he never fought like he should have to convince Jimmy to 1. Keep the Whole Lotta Medley "whole"; 2. Keep the Louie Louie-Thank You and Communication Breakdown encores; 3. Keep the Plantations ESPECIALLY his great line about "If everybody keeps their cool we can play all night!". 4. And to a lesser extent, "Tangerine", although I don't miss that as much as I miss the other stuff taken out of June 25, '72.

On top of all that, there was the crime of Kevin Shirley remaining silent as Jimmy butchered "No Quarter" and "Celebration Day" and "Black Dog" and more during the remastering of "The Song Remains the Same". You are supposed to be a remastering genius. How could you let your name be attached to such needless butchering. I would have fought tooth and claw until Jimmy came to his senses and realized the album didn't have to correspond to the movie and that it was a total disservice to fans everywhere.

3 hours ago, 76229 said:

Looks like there's been a subtraction rather than addition; someone on the Steve Hoffman Forum said the running time of Whole Lotta Love implies Hello Marylou has been cut from the medley

Jesus. What's the fucking point then of even doing this?

For all the complaints about bootleggers, by the band and fans alike, every time Jimmy has had a chance to cut off the bootleggers money supply he has whiffed.

1. BBC April 1 1971 Paris Theatre.

I thought I could throw (well, sell actually) away my old crappy vinyl when Jimmy first released the BBC Sessions back in the 1990s. Errr, nope. Communication Breakdown was missing as well as bits of the Whole Lotta Love. Okay, then when the remastered version came out last year I thought maybe it would be fixed. Nope.

So you still need the bootleg to get the complete picture.

2. HTWWW. June 25 and 27, 1972 LA Forum and Long Beach Arena.

Whichever night he chose for individual songs, Jimmy still should have been able to present the LA Forum encores complete, as well as the Whole Lotta Medley. So what if Elvis Presley estate wants some money for "Heartbreak Hotel"? They can afford it! Plus they would have sold more copies of HTWWW if they had included the complete show, along with Plant's banter. Fans WANT that shit! 

So once again, instead of buying HTWWW fans that wanted the complete show were forced to go to bootleg or torrent sources.

The same with TSRTS, although not as egregious as BBC and HTWWW.

If Jimmy is preparing an Earls Court release, odds are you will still need to hold on to your EC bootlegs to have a complete show.

That is why the Japanese love Jimmy Page...he actually helps them stay in business.

[LedElvis75]

41 minutes ago, Strider said:

 

Kevin Shirley is persona non grata as far as I'm concerned. He should never be allowed to work on a Led Zeppelin project again. Not just for what he did to the sound of HTWWW (when the audience tape sounds more natural than the official release you know you've fucked up), but also because he never fought like he should have to convince Jimmy to 1. Keep the Whole Lotta Medley "whole"; 2. Keep the Louie Louie-Thank You and Communication Breakdown encores; 3. Keep the Plantations ESPECIALLY his great line about "If everybody keeps their cool we can play all night!". 4. And to a lesser extent, "Tangerine", although I don't miss that as much as I miss the other stuff taken out of June 25, '72.

On top of all that, there was the crime of Kevin Shirley remaining silent as Jimmy butchered "No Quarter" and "Celebration Day" and "Black Dog" and more during the remastering of "The Song Remains the Same". You are supposed to be a remastering genius. How could you let your name be attached to such needless butchering. I would have fought tooth and claw until Jimmy came to his senses and realized the album didn't have to correspond to the movie and that it was a total disservice to fans everywhere.

Jesus. What's the fucking point then of even doing this?

For all the complaints about bootleggers, by the band and fans alike, every time Jimmy has had a chance to cut off the bootleggers money supply he has whiffed.

1. BBC April 1 1971 Paris Theatre.

I thought I could throw (well, sell actually) away my old crappy vinyl when Jimmy first released the BBC Sessions back in the 1990s. Errr, nope. Communication Breakdown was missing as well as bits of the Whole Lotta Love. Okay, then when the remastered version came out last year I thought maybe it would be fixed. Nope.

So you still need the bootleg to get the complete picture.

2. HTWWW. June 25 and 27, 1972 LA Forum and Long Beach Arena.

Whichever night he chose for individual songs, Jimmy still should have been able to present the LA Forum encores complete, as well as the Whole Lotta Medley. So what if Elvis Presley estate wants some money for "Heartbreak Hotel"? They can afford it! Plus they would have sold more copies of HTWWW if they had included the complete show, along with Plant's banter. Fans WANT that shit! 

So once again, instead of buying HTWWW fans that wanted the complete show were forced to go to bootleg or torrent sources.

The same with TSRTS, although not as egregious as BBC and HTWWW.

If Jimmy is preparing an Earls Court release, odds are you will still need to hold on to your EC bootlegs to have a complete show.

That is why the Japanese love Jimmy Page...he actually helps them stay in business.

Yeah, what he said!

[porgie66]

1 hour ago, Strider said:

 

Kevin Shirley is persona non grata as far as I'm concerned. He should never be allowed to work on a Led Zeppelin project again. Not just for what he did to the sound of HTWWW (when the audience tape sounds more natural than the official release you know you've fucked up), but also because he never fought like he should have to convince Jimmy to 1. Keep the Whole Lotta Medley "whole"; 2. Keep the Louie Louie-Thank You and Communication Breakdown encores; 3. Keep the Plantations ESPECIALLY his great line about "If everybody keeps their cool we can play all night!". 4. And to a lesser extent, "Tangerine", although I don't miss that as much as I miss the other stuff taken out of June 25, '72.

On top of all that, there was the crime of Kevin Shirley remaining silent as Jimmy butchered "No Quarter" and "Celebration Day" and "Black Dog" and more during the remastering of "The Song Remains the Same". You are supposed to be a remastering genius. How could you let your name be attached to such needless butchering. I would have fought tooth and claw until Jimmy came to his senses and realized the album didn't have to correspond to the movie and that it was a total disservice to fans everywhere.

Jesus. What's the fucking point then of even doing this?

For all the complaints about bootleggers, by the band and fans alike, every time Jimmy has had a chance to cut off the bootleggers money supply he has whiffed.

1. BBC April 1 1971 Paris Theatre.

I thought I could throw (well, sell actually) away my old crappy vinyl when Jimmy first released the BBC Sessions back in the 1990s. Errr, nope. Communication Breakdown was missing as well as bits of the Whole Lotta Love. Okay, then when the remastered version came out last year I thought maybe it would be fixed. Nope.

So you still need the bootleg to get the complete picture.

2. HTWWW. June 25 and 27, 1972 LA Forum and Long Beach Arena.

Whichever night he chose for individual songs, Jimmy still should have been able to present the LA Forum encores complete, as well as the Whole Lotta Medley. So what if Elvis Presley estate wants some money for "Heartbreak Hotel"? They can afford it! Plus they would have sold more copies of HTWWW if they had included the complete show, along with Plant's banter. Fans WANT that shit! 

So once again, instead of buying HTWWW fans that wanted the complete show were forced to go to bootleg or torrent sources.

The same with TSRTS, although not as egregious as BBC and HTWWW.

If Jimmy is preparing an Earls Court release, odds are you will still need to hold on to your EC bootlegs to have a complete show.

That is why the Japanese love Jimmy Page...he actually helps them stay in business.

Strider, I was about to go on a rant after seeing Sam's post regarding the new cash grab release ...but you said , much more articulately and passionately, what I wanted to say! Eye Thank Ewe !!

By now Page and co should be well aware of what would make their diehard loyal fans happy. I guess we will see if there is any response come September. 

 

[rm2551]

But is it really a cash grab? Isn't they guy rich enough that cash is never going to be a problem???

If whatever motivates these decisions (cuts and tracks left off) is not the cashiola, what is the motivation for this when obviously the fans (especially the hardcore ones) hate these let downs???

Maybe it is money, but if not, what?

[Adam Ryan watson]

I also say leaving blueberry hill of the hwww while lotta love medley is a crime as well. Those 1971 and 72 whole lotta love medleys were some of zeppelin finest moments as a live band and it's a crime of the worst kind that we will most likely never get a full wlh medley from either of those years in a official release.

[IpMan]

2 hours ago, rm2551 said:

But is it really a cash grab? Isn't they guy rich enough that cash is never going to be a problem???

If whatever motivates these decisions (cuts and tracks left off) is not the cashiola, what is the motivation for this when obviously the fans (especially the hardcore ones) hate these let downs???

Maybe it is money, but if not, what?

Believe me, it's money. It's ALWAYS money.

[rm2551]

Just now, IpMan said:

Believe me, it's money. It's ALWAYS money.

I'll never understand how an artist can have enough money and a high enough level of comfort / lifestyle - and would continue to prioritise money when it seems artistically it's patently a bad decision. Hence, my skepticism it is just the dosh. Doesn't add up.

[IpMan]

2 minutes ago, rm2551 said:

I'll never understand how an artist can have enough money and a high enough level of comfort / lifestyle - and would continue to prioritise money when it seems artistically it's patently a bad decision. Hence, my skepticism it is just the dosh. Doesn't add up.

Some people it can never be enough, it's pathological really and a shame.

[tmtomh]

I believe part of the issue is that if a song is covered straight, then there's a "mechanical rate," a standard royalty rate that gets paid. But if the work is adapted/changed - for example being included as part of a medley in another song, as Zep always did - then the mechanical rate goes out the window and the rights holder can basically name their price or even refuse to give permission altogether.

If this is correct (and if anyone here's a lawyer with expertise in this area, please correct me if I'm wrong!), then it could be that Page simply could not get permission at any price for some of this stuff; or that the price was so exorbitant for some of it as to eat up most of the likely profit from the release.

Not being an apologist - just pointing out that the royalty cost and permission issues are more complex when it comes to stuff adapted for a medley.

[Adam Ryan watson]

Sometimes the rights to a song may be held by numerous parties and not just 1 person and you may have to get permission from if half a dozen different people and  you would have to work out 6 different royalty deals and sometimes it may be impossible to even determine who all the rights holders are . Also who owns the rights to a certain song  may be the subject of an ongoing court battle so in that case a deal would be impossible. So in some cases it may just be page bot wanting  to  pay.

[Boleskinner]

The bigger picture here is that the remaster does not include any extra tracks.

Hopefully they are being held back for the 50th celebration later in the year.