Zeppelin Mysteries Hosted by Steve A. Jones

[dazedjeffy]

I always read that the "official" attendance at this record-breaking concert was 76,229. Not 77,229. I am pretty sure that 76,229 is correct becuase I have that number etched into my brain since I first read about this concert more than 20 years ago. 76,229 is the official number but who knows how many other people managed to obtain entry to this concert. I do not know the exact number of seats the Pontiac Silverdome actually held, but I would not be surprised if the figure was not higher than the official count. Probably or possibly over 80,000?

Seats and capacity are two different things. In 1987, 93,682 were in capacity at the Pontiac Silverdome for a mass led by Pope John II.

[lzzoso]

Seats and capacity are two different things. In 1987, 93,682 were in capacity at the Pontiac Silverdome for a mass led by Pope John II.

I realize that seats and capacity are two different things. That is why I would question the actual attendance for this Led Zeppelin concert at the Pontiac Silverdome. If 76,229 people actually paid for their tickets, then, like I said, there is a Great possiblity that a few more thousand LZ fans made it into this venue (paid or otherwise) on this record-breaking "Evening" with Led Zeppelin. However, I do believe that the "official" figure for the attendance of this gig was 76,229. If I happen to be incorrect, I welcome any and all evidence to the contrary.

[dave2007]

Seats and capacity are two different things. In 1987, 93,682 were in capacity at the Pontiac Silverdome for a mass led by Pope John II.

Ha..funny you should mention that.

I always remember when Pope John Paul 2 held a series of open air masses in the UK late seventies....he drew a crowd of about 300,000 at Heaton Park in Manchester. 'Sounds" (weekly music mag in UK at the time)...reported this with the headline

"Pope Bigger Than Led Zeppelin Shock !!"

Still amuses me

Edited August 12, 2010 by dave2007

[bluecongo]

My mystery question is:

Who is telling the truth about the Knebworth attendance figures?

Mick Wall states attendance for the 2nd show was only like 40,000. 1st show maybe 100,000.

Zep camp states 1st show what, 250,000?

We all know Grant was a greedy coke head in those days, but promoters are usually greedy coke heads too!

What's the truth?

[zdr]

Yes, the question above bothered me too.

Another question: I think I read somewhere that Zep were the first one to use big screens at concerts. I can't find the reference anymore. Did I dream that?

[SteveAJones]

My mystery question is:

Who is telling the truth about the Knebworth attendance figures?

Mick Wall states attendance for the 2nd show was only like 40,000. 1st show maybe 100,000.

Zep camp states 1st show what, 250,000?

We all know Grant was a greedy coke head in those days, but promoters are usually greedy coke heads too!

What's the truth?

This link presents a pretty good overview of the band vs. promoter dispute concerning attendance figures:

http://onthisdayinledzeppelinhistory.blogspot.com/2009/09/far-behind-music.html

[LZ77]

The 1977 Mid-Tour Break

On April 30, 1977 Led Zeppelin set a single-act world record when they performed for approximately 77,229 at the Pontiac Silverdome. This was the last date of the first leg of their 1977 North American tour. It's known they arrived at Detroit Metropolitan Airport in Romulus, MI the day of the concert and took a chartered bus to the Silverdome, having declined the venue's offer to transport them directly to the site using helicopters. They arrived at the venue at 9:10pm and the concert ran 9:30pm - 1am, to include a second three minute encore.

The May 2nd 1977 'Detroit News' reported they were immediately flown toward their two-week break, however I have obtained a photograph which proves they remained in the local area for at least several hours following the concert. I am attempting to secure the release of all additional photographs taken by the photographer after their record-breaking concert.

Robert Plant at the Troy Hilton in Troy, Michigan on May 1st 1977

Courtesy Steve A. Jones Archive

"This is one of my favorite pics that I took at the Troy Hilton after the Led Zep show at the Silverdome back in '77. Got to hang out with Page & Plant that late evening. Bonham was totally messed up, resting his head on the bar downstairs, drunk as hell. What a memory; so cool!" - Photographer

Steve, please post more photos from the photographer if you can!

[noodle]

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[SteveAJones]

Another question: I think I read somewhere that Zep were the first one to use big screens at concerts. I can't find the reference anymore. Did I dream that?

They could be considered among the first but certainly not the first as The Rolling Stones, for just one example, were using big screens at concerts before them.

[When My Levis Broke]

When I bought LZ1 on vinyl decades ago, I was pleasantly surprised to find that How Many More Times didn't last 3.30, but instead about 8.30. I've always assumed this was an innocent printing mistake, although the first part of the song does come to a logical stop-point at around 3.30. Then I read somewhere recently (Wikipedia I think) that the 3.30 was a deliberate mistake, Jimmy's idea to trick radio DJs into playing a really long song! Is this true, please?

[zdr]

They could be considered among the first but certainly not the first as The Rolling Stones, for just one example, were using big screens at concerts before them.

Thanks. I found out finaly the article that misleaded me:

http://www.tpimagazine.com/Chronicle/274561/birth_of_the_big_screen.html

But now I have another question: who was the first to use the sintagma "Golden God"? It was Robert self-proclaiming? Or it was some newspaper and Robert found it funny and yelled it from that balcony?

[dazedjeffy]

But now I have another question: who was the first to use the sintagma "Golden God"? It was Robert self-proclaiming? Or it was some newspaper and Robert found it funny and yelled it from that balcony?

He said it in a March 1975 interview with Stephen Davis, who details the interview very well in his new book LZ-'75. There are photographs in the book that show the exact moment where he said it in the hotel room.

[zdr]

He said it in a March 1975 interview with Stephen Davis, who details the interview very well in his new book LZ-'75. There are photographs in the book that show the exact moment where he said it in the hotel room.

I don't have the book.

So I would be interesed to know the circumstances: it was Plant who came up with the idea of being a Golden God or it was the interviewer who bring it up so Plant pick up the ideea and yelled it loud?

[jsj]

This link presents a pretty good overview of the band vs. promoter dispute concerning attendance figures:

http://onthisdayinle...hind-music.html

very interesting though unpleasant reading.

so freddie bannister states that 104000 tickets were sold for the first show and estimates that in total 150000 attended the two shows., thus in his opinion

104000 august 4th and 46000 for august 11th

[3hrsoflunacy]

Steve,

Do you have the recording dates for the Unledded special that aired on MTV?

Thanks!

[SteveAJones]

Steve,

Do you have the recording dates for the Unledded special that aired on MTV?

Thanks!

Yes, I do and will post the details later today.

Here are the details:

Feb 1994: Jimmy & Robert rehearse at Depot Studios near Kings Cross in London using a series of drum loops as backing tracks. Soonafter, they recorded a demo of 'Wonderful One' at RAK Recording Studios in St. John's Wood.

May 1994: Jimmy & Robert rehearsed for a week and discussed if they should attempt 'Wearing And Tearing'.

Jul 1994: Jimmy & Robert recorded a demo of 'Battle Of Evermore' with Indian vocalist Najma Akhtar at Mayfair Recording Studios in Primrose Hill, London.

Aug 1, 1994: MTV officially announced Jimmy Page & Robert Plant will perform on an upcoming special

Aug 5, 1994: Fly from London to Rabat, Morocco

Aug 6, 1994: Rabat, Morocco. Radio-Television Marocaine (RTM) (15335khz) Studios

Scheduled rehearsal with Moroccan Orchestra at the government-controlled broadcasting studio

Aug 7, 1994: Rabat, Morocco. Radio-Television Marocaine (RTM) (15335khz) Studios

Scheduled rehearsal with Moroccan Orchestra at the government-controlled broadcasting studio

Aug 8, 1994: Drive from Rabat to Marrakech, Morocco

Aug 9, 1994: Marrakech, Morocco. Filming of 'Wah Wah' and 'City Don't Cry' (two or three takes) sequence for 'MTV - Unledded' telecast

Aug 10, 1994: Marrakech, Morocco. Djemma El Fna Square

Filming at 6pm of 'Loop' (later retitled 'Yallah' and then changed to ''The Truth Explodes' on the dvd release

Aug 15, 1994: Machynlleth, Wales

Jimmy, Robert and band assemble and prepare for tomorrow's filming.

Aug 16, 1994: Dolgoth, Wales. Dolgoth Falls

Filming of 'No Quarter' outdoors at night (about four takes with the third one chosen to be used for the telecast)

Aug 17, 1994: Corris, Wales. Corris Slate Quarry

Filming of 'Gallows Pole', 'Nobody's Fault But Mine', & 'When The Levee Breaks' outdoors

Aug 18, 1994: Band returns from Wales and regroups in London

Aug 19, 1994: Rehearsal day

Aug 22, 1994: London Television Centre - London Studios Limited (Upper Ground London SE1 9LT)

Set up studio shoot and also orchestra rehearsals

Aug 23, 1994: London Television Centre - London Studios Limited (Upper Ground London SE1 9LT)

Band rehearsals with cameras in studio

Aug 24, 1994: London Television Centre - London Studios Limited (Upper Ground London SE1 9LT)

Band rehearsals with cameras in studio (second day)

Aug 25, 1994: London Television Centre - London Studios Limited (Upper Ground London SE1 9LT)

Recording and filming without orchestras in front of a select audience for 'MTV Unledded' telecast

Aug 26, 1994: London Television Centre - London Studios Limited (Upper Ground London SE1 9LT)

Recording and filming with orchestras in front of a select audience for 'MTV Unledded' telecast

Sep 19, 1994 Charlotte Street (London)

Jimmy was seen in this area known for it's many video production facilities prior to world premier of 'MTV Unledded'

Sep 20, 1994 Camden High Street

Page/Plant filmed interview for promotional Electronic Press Kit - 'Unledded - No Quarter'. They would oversee the editing of the tapes for what would be telecast in North America on October 11th as 'Unledded - Jimmy Page & Robert Plant: No Quarter'.

Edited August 29, 2010 by SteveAJones

[3hrsoflunacy]

WoW, Thanks Steve. Now that's an answer!

[Wolfman]

Steve, do you any clue what the plans were for the '77 Philly show that was going to be filmed (before it was cancelled due to Karac's death)? Was it going to be a filmed concert or an actual movie like TSRTS? Damn shame it didn't happen.

Edited August 31, 2010 by Wolfman

[SteveAJones]

Steve, do you any clue what the plans were for the '77 Philly show that was going to be filmed (before it was cancelled due to Karac's death)? Was it going to be a filmed concert or an actual movie like TSRTS? Damn shame it didn't happen.

I'll have to get back to you on this one. Some consideration may have been given to documenting latter dates of the tour, though it's unlikely there were any plans for a theatrical release.

[And You Know How It Is?]

Hi Steve,

Did Zep ever consider any warm up dates in Europe (or anywhere else for that matter) prior to the start of the 1977 US Tour? Even before Robert contracted laryngitis?

They had been off the road for 2 years, and one would think that like the 75 US tour, where they hadn't played in 18 months yet warmed up in Europe (Amsterdam and Brussels), they would have done one or two shows before the start of the 77 tour. They did two warm up dates in Copenhagen in 79 before Knebworth, and even on the 72 US tour, they did Amsterdam and Brussels prior.

Just surprised they wouldn't have done a show or two in Europe before heading to the US in 1977, given the almost 2 years gap between live performances. But, maybe they planned to, before Robert lost his voice?

[SteveAJones]

Thanks. I found out finaly the article that misleaded me:

http://www.tpimagazi...big_screen.html

But now I have another question: who was the first to use the sintagma "Golden God"? It was Robert self-proclaiming? Or it was some newspaper and Robert found it funny and yelled it from that balcony?

It was a spontaneous exclamation Robert Plant made during the interview as he surveyed the Sunset Strip from the Continental Hyatt House in March 1975.

[SteveAJones]

Hi Steve,

Did Zep ever consider any warm up dates in Europe (or anywhere else for that matter) prior to the start of the 1977 US Tour? Even before Robert contracted laryngitis?

They had been off the road for 2 years, and one would think that like the 75 US tour, where they hadn't played in 18 months yet warmed up in Europe (Amsterdam and Brussels), they would have done one or two shows before the start of the 77 tour. They did two warm up dates in Copenhagen in 79 before Knebworth, and even on the 72 US tour, they did Amsterdam and Brussels prior.

Just surprised they wouldn't have done a show or two in Europe before heading to the US in 1977, given the almost 2 years gap between live performances. But, maybe they planned to, before Robert lost his voice?

The plan was to hold extensive rehearsals. According to Jimmy, tour rehearsals began "about a month before Christmas" (1976) and continued until the holiday break. In January 1977 they reconvened at Manticore in Fulham for another month of uninterrupted rehearsals, usually ten hours a day.

During rehearsals, the opening night of the tour, Fort Worth on Feb 27th, as well as Dallas on Mar 4th, were announced on Jan 20th. Eight additional dates, including three at The Forum in Los Angeles, were announced on Jan 25th, and all ten shows sold out. Three additional nights at The Forum were immediately announced following the sold-out status of the first three. These thirteen dates were postponed on

Feb 24th on account of Robert's tonsilitis. Three Canadien dates (Toronto on Apr 1st, Montreal on Apr 3 & 4) were postponed on Mar 4th (the death of Karac Plant in July ruled out any chance of rescheduling).

Meanwhile, the band's gear had already been shipped to the United States in anticipation of opening night in Fort Worth. According to Jimmy, he did not touch a guitar again until rehearsals held at Memorial Auditorium in Dallas from Mar 29-31 1977 (nearly a month of inactivity). Coincidentally, the tour opened there on April Fools Day, the Fort Worth date having been rescheduled for May 22nd.

[And You Know How It Is?]

Three Canadien dates (Toronto on Apr 1st, Montreal on Apr 3 & 4) were postponed on Mar 4th (the death of Karac Plant in July ruled out any chance of rescheduling).

Thanks Steve. These Canadien dates are a mystery now, in a sense. If they were postponed on March 4, I wonder if they ever had plans to reschedule them? I mean, they started the third leg of the tour in Seattle on July 17, yet never rescheduled these Canadien dates.

They certainly rescheduled other shows after postponing them: everything in your list plus dates like Tempe, Arizona (originally March 6, rescheduled to July 20) and San Diego (originally March 8, rescheduled to June 19).

I wonder if there was a conflict/rift between Zep/Peter Grant/Canadien promoters? Seems like an awfully long time passed for the opportunity to reschedule these Canadien dates, before Robert's son's tragic death on July 26.

[SteveAJones]

Three Canadien dates (Toronto on Apr 1st, Montreal on Apr 3 & 4) were postponed on Mar 4th (the death of Karac Plant in July ruled out any chance of rescheduling).

Thanks Steve. These Canadien dates are a mystery now, in a sense. If they were postponed on March 4, I wonder if they ever had plans to reschedule them? I mean, they started the third leg of the tour in Seattle on July 17, yet never rescheduled these Canadien dates.

They certainly rescheduled other shows after postponing them: everything in your list plus dates like Tempe, Arizona (originally March 6, rescheduled to July 20) and San Diego (originally March 8, rescheduled to June 19).

I wonder if there was a conflict/rift between Zep/Peter Grant/Canadien promoters? Seems like an awfully long time passed for the opportunity to reschedule these Canadien dates, before Robert's son's tragic death on July 26.

There's actually a Mar 4th postponement I overlooked - Hara Arena in Dayton, Ohio on Apr 22nd - and it was never rescheduled either. It seems to me Dayton as well as the three Canadien dates could have easily been tacked onto the end of the first leg of the tour which ended in Pontiac, Michigan on Apr 30th but we don't know all the planning factors involved at the time. It could have been non-availability of the venues or simply a willingness to sacrifice these dates for other dates in other cities. It is interesting to note their 1980 North American tour was to open at The Forum in Montreal (on Oct 17 1980) which can arguably be taken as a gesture of consolation towards their Canadien fans, if not an overt confirmation of the importance they placed on the Canadien market. Insofar as Toronto, earlier in this thread I examined the possibility that Peter Grant may have met his match, if you like, in hard-nosed Maple Leaf Gardens owner Harold Ballard and it may have been the main reason Led Zeppelin did not perform in Toronto from 1972-1977. Whatever the case may be, it's unfortunate the postponed April 1st 1977 Maple Leaf Gardens concert was never rescheduled.

Edited September 3, 2010 by SteveAJones

[Conneyfogle]

Found this on a Badfinger site, any info??

The Iveys

September 6, 1969 (Sunday)

City Hall

Wuppertall, Germany

with The New Yardbirds (Led Zeppelin)

Pete Ham's fuzz box was stolen