What Tour Would You Most Like To Be Released as a Box Set?

[Bonzo_fan]

I've really been getting into the Grateful Dead since last summer, and I recently bought six of the Europe 1972 shows on iTunes (4/8 London, 4/24 Dusseldorf, 4/26 Frankfurt, 5/3 Paris, 5/7 Bickershaw Festival & 5/11 Rotterdam for those interested).  I think it's pretty amazing to have an entire tour released "warts and all"--though there are few warts on this tour--in multi-track quality.  I can't help but wish there was something similar for Led Zeppelin.

So, the question is, which Zeppelin tour (or leg thereof) would you most like to see receive the "Europe '72" treatment, assuming same was possible?  The Dead's Europe '72 tour was 22 shows, but it's ok if your Zeppelin tour of choice is significantly longer (or shorter) than that.

My initial reaction is that I would choose the 1975 North American Tour.  The first leg for some of the most unique setlists of their career, and the second leg for perhaps their most consistent leg ever performance-wise.  I mean seriously, what's the worst show of that second leg?  3/14 San Diego?  3/24 Los Angeles?

[mrledhed]

NORTH AMERICA 1973

Edited August 13, 2016 by mrledhed

[TheGreatOne]

Iceland and the U.K. '71 shows

[duckman]

Japan 1971

and second close: Continental Europe March/April 1973

[Walter]

5 hours ago, duckman said:

Japan 1971

and second close: Continental Europe March/April 1973

Perfect! 

[IpMan]

8 hours ago, duckman said:

Japan 1971

and second close: Continental Europe March/April 1973

Spot on, however the west coast run in 75' would be quite welcome as well as a best of the 2nd leg of 77'.

[porgie66]

Too hard to choose just one! But '71 Japan would be brilliant. There are some wicked good spring 73 shows too, especially Hamburg,  Vienna, Munich, Offenburg. Incredible playing, super loose improvising. 

I agree that 75 was pretty consistent but also monochromatic. I think Plants vocal tracks post 1972 are the real turd in the punchbowl. A lot of fixing/editing would have to be done for an acceptable release of most 73, 75 or 77 shows, not to mention Jimmy's sloppy playing on the 75 and 77 tours as well.

I brought this up in another thread but here is a good place to ask. Are there even any real known multi-track tapes of any shows?

I can't see Jimmy and Co working on soundboard feeds for a "bootleg series". 

[chillumpuffer]

1971 till the end of 1972. 1975 too predictable and dull at times. 1977 well..... 35 minutes of Bonzo and a wailing guitar solo and not forgetting the man who appeared to lose the ability to play the guitar

Grateful Dead Bickershaw Festival - a great show and in great quality too

Edited August 14, 2016 by chillumpuffer

[JTM]

4 hours ago, chillumpuffer said:

1971 till the end of 1972. 1975 too predictable and dull at times. 1977 well..... 35 minutes of Bonzo and a wailing guitar solo and not forgetting the man who appeared to lose the ability to play the guitar

Grateful Dead Bickershaw Festival - a great show and in great quality too

Spot on, 71/72 was the peak for me... Talking about Bickershaw  I so wanted to join a schoolmate who went with his older sisters boyfriend, but my Mum was having non of it, would have spent my fifteenth birthday there....

[greenman]

Its a tough one as Japan 71 and euro 73 are probably correctly viewed as peaks of the band BUT I think you could argue that the former is a little short whilst the latter did tend to be rather similar. Personally I might go for either the Spring US 70 tour of the UK autumn 71 tours, both peaks not very far behind the above two but also quite a bit longer with a good deal of variety.

Really the US 73, 75 and 77 tours are already documented very well with SB's and good audience recordings so I don't think an official release would add as much reguardless of quality.

Of course if you look at what might actually happen then Japan 71 would seem to be the most likely as it would be a manageable size and we know recordings potentially existed.

Edited August 15, 2016 by greenman

[duckman]

6 hours ago, greenman said:

 

Japan 1971 would be the more realistic option. But as much as I'm advocating   an official release I'm also fairly pessimistic about it. Jimmy missed the momentum. First after discovering in the fall of 1971 that the multi's featured  substandard 'bootleg' balance and secondly in 2003 when the archive was inspected for a companion release to DVD. Remember they had a proper  name for it, Considering 21th  century  state of the art audio technology can do miracles...but alas it didn't. Townshend could fly in the Ox's bass track from Leeds 1971 to restore Hull in full glory. IMHO the Japan ZEP multi's however lack Percy's vocals in all but the more silent sections. So that is quite an obstacle not easily cured with whatever technology (with the unlikely exception of course of Robert performing some post factum studio overdubs)

This and the fact that a hefty royalty bills for all those Beatles covers and other Fortune Tellers, makes it unlikely that Made in Japan will ever be released in our lifetime

[rm2551]

22 minutes ago, duckman said:

Japan 1971 would be the more realistic option. But as much as I'm advocating   an official release I'm also fairly pessimistic about it. Jimmy missed the momentum. First after discovering in the fall of 1971 that the multi's featured  substandard 'bootleg' balance and secondly in 2003 when the archive was inspected for a companion release to DVD. Remember they had a proper  name for it, Considering 21th  century  state of the art audio technology can do miracles...but alas it didn't. Townshend could fly in the Ox's bass track from Leeds 1971 to restore Hull in full glory. IMHO the Japan ZEP multi's however lack Percy's vocals in all but the more silent sections. So that is quite an obstacle not easily cured with whatever technology (with the unlikely exception of course of Robert performing some post factum studio overdubs)

This and the fact that a hefty royalty bills for all those Beatles covers and other Fortune Tellers, makes it unlikely that Made in Japan will ever be released in our lifetime

I don't get the royalties thing. Isn't it like complaining about how much tax you pay? You pay tons of tax only when you earn shitloads of cash. So yeah, you get a hefty tax bill that is annoying, but only bewcause you earned SO MUCH coin. Wouldn't royalties be similar? Yeah, you pay a royaly - but that's on the albums you sell or times song is bought/downloaded/played on the radio - which is a percentage of the royalty Led Zep would get. Is that right??? So if a zep tune that's a Beatles cover was played on the radio, Zep get their due, and The Beatles as original artist get a cut?

Or do Zep miss out or go into the red monitarily with covers???

[greenman]

1 hour ago, duckman said:

Japan 1971 would be the more realistic option. But as much as I'm advocating   an official release I'm also fairly pessimistic about it. Jimmy missed the momentum. First after discovering in the fall of 1971 that the multi's featured  substandard 'bootleg' balance and secondly in 2003 when the archive was inspected for a companion release to DVD. Remember they had a proper  name for it, Considering 21th  century  state of the art audio technology can do miracles...but alas it didn't. Townshend could fly in the Ox's bass track from Leeds 1971 to restore Hull in full glory. IMHO the Japan ZEP multi's however lack Percy's vocals in all but the more silent sections. So that is quite an obstacle not easily cured with whatever technology (with the unlikely exception of course of Robert performing some post factum studio overdubs)

This and the fact that a hefty royalty bills for all those Beatles covers and other Fortune Tellers, makes it unlikely that Made in Japan will ever be released in our lifetime

I'd agree I'm not full of hope we'll see another large official release from Zep but you could argue the climate now is rather different. The DVD and HTWWW arguably filled the whole for official live Zep for the casual market and anything now is going to be aimed more at a hardcore audience as with Pink Floyd's(who previously you could argue were even more exacting that Page) recent releases for example.

As to what Japan 71 might sound like if the tapes still exist that's tough to say as I don't think its ever been certain exactly what the famous 29th recording actually is or where it comes from. Then you have the just released SB from the 28th that doesn't have a problem with vocal levels but perhaps that's from the standard board tapes not the multitracks?

One thing I think you could point to is that Page despite the case against that UK dealer has always seemed to be a bit of boot/unofficial fan so perhaps he's just happy to keep the less perfect stuff in that domain?

[chef free]

On 8/13/2016 at 0:25 PM, Bonzo_fan said:

I've really been getting into the Grateful Dead since last summer, and I recently bought six of the Europe 1972 shows on iTunes (4/8 London, 4/24 Dusseldorf, 4/26 Frankfurt, 5/3 Paris, 5/7 Bickershaw Festival & 5/11 Rotterdam for those interested).  I think it's pretty amazing to have an entire tour released "warts and all"--though there are few warts on this tour--in multi-track quality.  I can't help but wish there was something similar for Led Zeppelin.

So, the question is, which Zeppelin tour (or leg thereof) would you most like to see receive the "Europe '72" treatment, assuming same was possible?  The Dead's Europe '72 tour was 22 shows, but it's ok if your Zeppelin tour of choice is significantly longer (or shorter) than that.

My initial reaction is that I would choose the 1975 North American Tour.  The first leg for some of the most unique setlists of their career, and the second leg for perhaps their most consistent leg ever performance-wise.  I mean seriously, what's the worst show of that second leg?  3/14 San Diego?  3/24 Los Angeles?

This would be great!  Many bands from back-in-the-day have released tour boxes or at least official bootlegs "warts and all", The Stones, The Doors, King Crimson,  Rush, The Grateful Dead, etc. Yes just released a box with seven shows from 1972.  

I like the idea of Japan '71, Australia/New Zealand '72, Europe '73,  the first or second leg of the '75 US tour, and LA or NY '77.

P.S. Grateful Dead May 25, 1972, London is an EPIC Dead show!

[pluribus]

In the domain of "it's never gonna happen", I'd wish for the 2nd US tour from April/May 1969, the Summer US tour from August/Sept 1970, UK Club tour March 1971, or the European tour from March/April 1973.

For shows that might actually exist, I'd wish for Japan 1971 or the Montreux Concerts: 1970, 1971, 1972.

For shows that definitely exist I'd wish for a boxset of the 3 nights at Madison Square Garden 1973 in multitrack quality, unedited, the Los Angeles and Long Beach 1972 HTWWW shows, and the three multi-tracked Earls Court 1975 shows.

 

[The Only Way To Fly]

Surprised no one has mentioned summer 1970 - the two gigs in Copenhagen in 79, would be cool as would the one off gig in Reykjavik.

 

[Bonzo_fan]

9 hours ago, chef free said:

This would be great!  Many bands from back-in-the-day have released tour boxes or at least official bootlegs "warts and all", The Stones, The Doors, King Crimson,  Rush, The Grateful Dead, etc. Yes just released a box with seven shows from 1972.  

I like the idea of Japan '71, Australia/New Zealand '72, Europe '73,  the first or second leg of the '75 US tour, and LA or NY '77.

P.S. Grateful Dead May 25, 1972, London is an EPIC Dead show!

Ok, thanks!  I'll add that to my list of ones to get once I've taken care of tuition and books for the year lol.

[duckman]

On 15 augustus 2016 at 11:54 AM, rm2551 said:

 

Or do Zep miss out or go into the red monitarily with covers???

Nope but on the other hand, profit would be minimal and not justifying the pretty steep production costs for a comprehensive Japan 1971  live Boxed Set...it all depends, a lot of the fifties popular music is already public domain. The Beatles catalog on the other hand is big business 

[duckman]

On 15 augustus 2016 at 1:28 PM, greenman said:

 

As to what Japan 71 might sound like if the tapes still exist that's tough to say as I don't think its ever been certain exactly what the famous 29th recording actually is or where it comes from. Then you have the just released SB from the 28th that doesn't have a problem with vocal levels but perhaps that's from the standard board tapes not the multitracks?

 

Yes that what Robert was stating in November 1971 (after complaining about the bad balance of the mutli track recordings)  "we made recordings with an ordinary Revox that sounded better"

[ZosoAddict]

Japan 1971 and/or North America 1975

[schmoe]

"IMHO the Japan ZEP multi's however lack Percy's vocals in all but the more silent sections. So that is quite an obstacle not easily cured with whatever technology (with the unlikely exception of course of Robert performing some post factum studio overdubs"

How can the vocal balance be off on a multi-track? Isn't the vocal a stand-alone track?

 

[Bonzo_fan]

On August 15, 2016 at 0:18 PM, chef free said:

This would be great!  Many bands from back-in-the-day have released tour boxes or at least official bootlegs "warts and all", The Stones, The Doors, King Crimson,  Rush, The Grateful Dead, etc. Yes just released a box with seven shows from 1972.  

I like the idea of Japan '71, Australia/New Zealand '72, Europe '73,  the first or second leg of the '75 US tour, and LA or NY '77.

P.S. Grateful Dead May 25, 1972, London is an EPIC Dead show!

I ended up buying it last night, couldn't resist--you're right, it's fantastic!  Best "Wharf Rat" I've ever heard.

[Bonzo_fan]

On August 14, 2016 at 8:59 AM, JTM said:

Spot on, 71/72 was the peak for me... Talking about Bickershaw  I so wanted to join a schoolmate who went with his older sisters boyfriend, but my Mum was having non of it, would have spent my fifteenth birthday there....

Oh man, that bites.  I bet my mom would've done the same thing :/ 

[chef free]

On 8/16/2016 at 8:58 PM, Bonzo_fan said:

I ended up buying it last night, couldn't resist--you're right, it's fantastic!  Best "Wharf Rat" I've ever heard.

The next day is even better!  Ever wonder what happened between the Truckin' and Morning Dew from the Europe '72 record?

[greenman]

On ‎17‎/‎08‎/‎2016 at 0:48 AM, schmoe said:

"IMHO the Japan ZEP multi's however lack Percy's vocals in all but the more silent sections. So that is quite an obstacle not easily cured with whatever technology (with the unlikely exception of course of Robert performing some post factum studio overdubs"

How can the vocal balance be off on a multi-track? Isn't the vocal a stand-alone track?

That would be my feeling although perhaps there might have been some bleed?

If we assume that the 29/9/71 source is from the multitrack recording then I could see the issue being less Plants vocals and more the way the bass/drums. .Plant afterall is generally pretty clear even if he is low in the mix where as the bass and drums are clearly overloaded at points. That would seem to make more sense as well since at that point the Japanese recording enginers might not have expereinced a band was loud as Zep bass wise..

When exactly did the 29/9/71 souce first emerge? I know it dates back at least to the 80's as it was originally on vinyl but does it date back to the 70's? if it is from the multitrack perhaps it might represent a basic mix down that Page was given by the Japanese or made himself? that might explain the cuts a bit more.

In terms of whether its better than a basic SB I do think that even with its faults there are a terrific energy to the 29/9 recording that you don't get with any Zep SB's. Indeed I actually think part of why the show is so legendary is actually because of the pounding bass heavy mix giving it an energy that even most offical live releases(such as HTWWW) lack. Its more like the kind of thing a band like MC5 would have released.

Edited August 19, 2016 by greenman