The Vaccine for Covid is coming fast

[JohnOsbourne]

Just now, 1975NQ said:

In terms of central banks being cornered .. yep, I'm with you. In terms of them theoretically using the virus to help achieve their own ends ..  I agree they're not above that (or anything, really). I'm just bringing this down to a more human, boots on the ground level. I know long covid is real because I've seen it in my daily life. And all the studies I've read seem pretty legit (with the 1 out of 5 thing). I hope I'm wrong, I really do. But just doing the math on it, if this thing mutates to something "mild" that still fucks up 1 out of 5 people - or even 1 out of 10 - in a way that severely limits their being able to enjoy life .. that to me feels like a problem.

Again, I hope I'm wrong. If this thing mutated to something insignificant that didn't mess up anyone long term, that would be a massive relief. I just don't know how realistic that is. It's a brand new thing, a man-made weapon that's running amok. Regardless of sinister banks and govs, I really hope the people wearing white coats science the shit out of this sooner vs later.

The virus (and presumably its variants) is real, but the threat it poses outside of specific demographics (the elderly with preexisting comorbidities) has been obscenely exaggerated and exploited.  They clearly aren't going to give up on the fear-mongering, the amount of control and power they've gained from all of this would have been completely unthinkable two years ago.  

[1975NQ]

Just now, JohnOsbourne said:

The virus (and presumably its variants) is real, but the threat it poses outside of specific demographics (the elderly with preexisting comorbidities) has been obscenely exaggerated and exploited.  They clearly aren't going to give up on the fear-mongering, the amount of control and power they've gained from all of this would have been completely unthinkable two years ago.  

Yeah, I agree with all that. BUT - the people I know with long covid are all under the age of 40, all normal healthy people with no underlying issues. I suspect long covid is being under-reported. It's really hard to know what's what, I can only go on my personal experiences and studies I've read from legit sources. I steer clear of biased news as much as humanly possible and just try and separate the wheat from the chaff as much as I can with new developments.

To each their own, I respect different people's beliefs. Like you say, there's a ton of disinformation out there. I personally am just gonna try my damnedest to not catch it for as long as I can. Prudence and all that.

[Stryder1978]

12 hours ago, hummingbird69 said:

Trump was called a anti muslim for shutting down travel from several countries with a predominate muslim population. I wonder if ole Brandon is being outright racist by shutting down travel from countries with a predominately black population??????  Imagine that, stopping black people from coming here???

If anyone from those countries gets into mexico can they come across the border illegally??

Excellent point!  And not a word about this from the media...big surprise!

[BobDobbs]

2 hours ago, Stryder1978 said:

Excellent point!  And not a word about this from the media...big surprise!

Let's review the differences shall we?

1. The Muslim ban was not due to a viral outbreak or to stop the spread of a viral outbreak. It was aimed at preventing Muslims from entering the US period.

2. The South African travel ban is to help prevent the spread of the COVID virus.

 

A better comparison would be Trump's China travel ban during the early days of the COVID outbreak. This was the proper idea however he did it way too late (the US was the 45th country to do this in Feb 2020, nine days after other nations had issued travel bans from China). Plus, he never fully restricted Chinese travel, it was a partial restriction only.

Trump’s ‘early’ travel ‘bans’ weren’t early, weren’t bans and didn’t work - The Washington Post

[Stryder1978]

...you forgot to include the fact that the "Muslim ban" was because those were countries that didn't vet their citizens for travel.  We had no idea who those people were that wanted to come to the U.S.  And given the level of Jihadism going on all over the world at that time, it was a reasonable policy.

OH...and the world found out about Omicron last week - yet Biden waited to ban travel from South Africa until this past Tuesday.  And this week - our first case of Omicron was detected in the US.  (even though it was inevitable to happen anyway). 

[Electrophile]

I don't know why I keep reading this thread, it only makes me angry. I tell myself, "Don't click on it, don't click on it, don't click on it"...and then I do. 

*sigh*

That's a "me" problem I've got to work on.

[Stryder1978]

Germany approves new restrictions for unvaccinated people

 

Oriana Gonzalez

Thu, December 2, 2021, 8:14 AM

 

 

German Chancellor Angela Merkel said Thursday that people who are unvaccinated will not be allowed in nonessential shops, cultural and recreational venues, AP reports.

State of play: Merkel, alongside incoming Chancellor Olaf Scholz, said the measures were necessary to avoid overflowing hospitals with coronavirus patients. The country is seeing an increase in daily infections.

Stay on top of the latest market trends and economic insights with Axios Markets. Subscribe for free

• Merkel said unvaccinated individuals won't be allowed to go into all businesses except essential ones like grocery stores and pharmacies.

• Germany is also considering a national vaccine mandate that would go into effect in February 2022, Merkel added.

 

By the numbers: Since the beginning of the pandemic, Germany has recorded 5,977,208 confirmed coronavirus cases and 102,178 deaths.

• On Thursday, 73,209 new cases were recorded, compared to the 67,186 new cases reported Wednesday.

What she's saying: "The situation in our country is serious with regard to the COVID-19 pandemic. We are reaching the limits of the response capacity in our hospitals," Merkel said, according to a translation from DW News.

• She said the restrictive measures are an "act of national solidarity so that we can reduce the rate of infections and ease the burden on our public health systems."

[BobDobbs]

2 hours ago, Electrophile said:

I don't know why I keep reading this thread, it only makes me angry. I tell myself, "Don't click on it, don't click on it, don't click on it"...and then I do. 

*sigh*

That's a "me" problem I've got to work on.

You and me both, I feel like one of the few adults in a room of pre-schoolers gone full Lord of the Flies.

You convinced me, I am out.

[Electrophile]

18 minutes ago, BobDobbs said:

You and me both, I feel like one of the few adults in a room of pre-schoolers gone full Lord of the Flies.

You convinced me, I am out.

I appreciate you fighting the good fight, but you can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into. But, hey. When Joe Biden was inaugurated, there were 3 million fully vaccinated people in this country. Now there's 196 million. Should there be more? Hell yes. Does that mean progress hasn't been made? Hell no. Keep moving onwards and upwards.

[JohnOsbourne]

Wonder what they're hiding:

Over 42,000 Adverse Reaction Reports Revealed In First Batch Of Pfizer Vax Docs | ZeroHedge

[cryingbluerain]

And so the latest round of omicron (moronic) hysteria begins..

https://news.yahoo.com/biden-requirement-testing-24-hours-015924028.html

Great, testing for international flights.  How about the thousands and thousands pouring across the southern border?  Oh, that's a different issue of course.  You can't make this shit up.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2021/12/01/fauci_asked_if_omnicrom_testing_applies_to_migrants_crossing_border_thats_a_different_issue.html

Edited December 3, 2021 by cryingbluerain

[SteveAJones]

14 hours ago, BobDobbs said:

You and me both, I feel like one of the few adults in a room of pre-schoolers gone full Lord of the Flies.

You convinced me, I am out.

Oh, bullshit. You'd be the last to leave this thread and your posts to it strongly suggest you're in no position to claim maturity.

14 hours ago, Electrophile said:

I appreciate you fighting the good fight, but you can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into. But, hey. When Joe Biden was inaugurated, there were 3 million fully vaccinated people in this country. Now there's 196 million. Should there be more? Hell yes. Does that mean progress hasn't been made? Hell no. Keep moving onwards and upwards.

This we can work with. The issue now as I see it is despite whatever the overall vaccination level is it's clear the feral governments are continuing to push for it to be above 90% to be followed by untold booster shots. We've gotten so far away from "12 days to flatten the curve" it's preposterous. People really need to wake up that this was NEVER about containing a virus that by the way STILL has an ABOVE 98% SURVIVAL RATE for those infected.   

[SteveAJones]

4 hours ago, cryingbluerain said:

And so the latest round of omicron (moronic) hysteria begins..

https://news.yahoo.com/biden-requirement-testing-24-hours-015924028.html

Great, testing for international flights.  How about the thousands and thousands pouring across the southern border?  Oh, that's a different issue of course.  You can't make this shit up.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2021/12/01/fauci_asked_if_omnicrom_testing_applies_to_migrants_crossing_border_thats_a_different_issue.html

Dr. Slouchy has long since been fully revealed as the lying weasel he is. He's principally and directly responsible for creating this Frankenstein in the first place. For justice to be served he should die from it in a prison.

[hummingbird69]

2 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

Dr. Slouchy has long since been fully revealed as the lying weasel he is. He's principally and directly responsible for creating this Frankenstein in the first place. For justice to be served he should die from it in a prison.

fauci said,  “no doubt” Donald J. Trump will be confronted with a surprise infectious disease outbreak during his presidency.  If it's a surprise how did he know.  Usually the only person who knows about the surprise is the person who set it up. Hmmmm?????

 We all know pandemics are going to happen but he truth is nobody knows when a pandemic will hit. There may not be another one for a hundred years and yet fauci was certain that trump would have to deal with one. That smells fishy to me.

[hummingbird69]

2 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

Oh, bullshit. You'd be the last to leave this thread and your posts to it strongly suggest you're in no position to claim maturity.

 

[rm2551]

1 hour ago, SteveAJones said:

This we can work with. The issue now as I see it is despite whatever the overall vaccination level is it's clear the feral governments are continuing to push for it to be above 90% to be followed by untold booster shots. We've gotten so far away from "12 days to flatten the curve" it's preposterous. People really need to wake up that this was NEVER about containing a virus that by the way STILL has an ABOVE 98% SURVIVAL RATE for those infected.

The push to go above 90% vaxx rate makes sense from a health/science perspective from what I understand - and I have not heard of credible scientific data/analysis that concludes vaccinations have a net negative effect, so it makes sense from a public health policy perspective from Government to push vaxx to 90% if the Gov. subscribes to the idea that the first duty of care (or at least equal first) is the health and well being of the population.

Non stop booster shots on the other hand - yeah, sounds SHIT. But then again, I don't know Steve, what is the alternative? Let it burn through? Maybe. At this point I'd say it's a good chance that that may be inevitable, which is terrifying for me considering my parents will probably be taken out by this (as well as in-laws). I still want a healthy community and I want not to pass this wretched thing on to anyone else should I get it. Especially family. Then there is the long term Covid symptoms that are getting more attention now. Lack of energy, brain fog, weakness, etc. That also sounds SHIT - and could end up being a real problem for us all.

I don't have answers Steve, and I appreciate your view much more now than at the beginning (seeing as you were criticised heavily for some views that were more inciteful than I think anyone realised at the time) and I continue to accept other views as legitimate *where that they are somewhat rational (I might not agree, but I think they are worthy of consideration and discussion - fuck knows I am not a fricking oracle!), and yeah, survival rates are high - but so is the death count. 5.2 million dead from 238.6 million infected. It's a pandemic after all! Not to mention the chance this thing will mutate into a much worse reality for humans is probably increasing the longer this shit is around.

So what to do?

I don't know of a better plan than to listen to the most educated in related fields of expertise (scientists, data analysts, medical and epidemiological experts) in our respective societies, and trust that Governments (at least in the West) really do have the populations best interest as the primary concern of policy making. Otherwise we are no different or better than authoritarian nightmares. I don't think that is remotely true for almost all western democracies - but that's another tangled conversation....

I can agree with tons of points highlighting how bad government is at bureaucracy, how this party or that party is completely corrupt or self serving, but I have to believe that those that occupy the highest office in western democratic countries are at least not driven by bullshit "hidden agenda" ideas.

In the end, without a scientific breakthrough that fucks this thing off for good, maybe protect the vulnerable and everyone can make their own risk assessments is maybe the only real position to take - which I believe has been your position for a while. I thought it was better off being fought against for a long time (especially since here in QLD, the fight has been amazingly successful) But we can't hide forever, and I don't like the trend of punishing the unvaccinated AT ALL. Even the never ending boosters aren't going to win the day. I expect sooner or later we (QLD) will have to deal with it.

I'm just glad there are alternate views in here and out there that are at least giving me food for thought. I don't agree with a lot of what you say Steve, (as I am sure you would reciprocate with my views - which is all good) but I do consider you offer a reasonable perspective most times agree or not. At least when you aren't being a pitbull 😉

Anyway, rant over, and I hope this is taken as it was meant.

Cheers.

[LedZeppfan1977]

17 hours ago, BobDobbs said:

You and me both, I feel like one of the few adults in a room of pre-schoolers gone full Lord of the Flies.

You convinced me, I am out.

Suuuuuuuure you are.    LOL.  You will be back

[Bong-Man]

And then there was one.....Detroit Red Wings' Tyler Bertuzzi, NHL's only unvaccinated player, in COVID-19 protocol (msn.com)

I don't agree with his stance, but unlike a few other professional athletes he's been honest about this from the get-go.  He hasn't been allowed on any trips to Canada, as he can't cross the border.  His pay is deducted accordingly.  Even though he's an important part of the team, I haven't heard much about their feelings either way.

As for Antonio Brown, liars suck.  Ban him from the league.   

[SteveAJones]

6 hours ago, rm2551 said:

The push to go above 90% vaxx rate makes sense from a health/science perspective from what I understand - and I have not heard of credible scientific data/analysis that concludes vaccinations have a net negative effect, so it makes sense from a public health policy perspective from Government to push vaxx to 90% if the Gov. subscribes to the idea that the first duty of care (or at least equal first) is the health and well being of the population.

Point 1. The CDC estimates there have already been 146 million COVID-19 infections in the United States. This means, essentially, that fully half of the US population has already attained immunity.

Point 2. The first confirmed Omnicron infection the patient was fully vaccinated. 

As I repeatedly stated in the earliest days of this planned-demic, the only way out is herd immunity. The feral governments didn't go that route because there's neither monetary nor political gain in doing so.

This was NEVER about a virus, the virus is merely a means to an end.

[SteveAJones]

[hummingbird69]

I want to know how fauci was "sure" that a surprise pandemic would hit during the trump admin.  You can say things like there will be a pandemic sometime in the future but there is no way anyone can say when it will happen unless they know in advance.  I mean there might not be another pandemic for a hundred years and yet fauci was "sure"  it would happen.  How could he know that?  Usually the only person to know about a surprise is the person who planned it. 

For those of you who don't think he said it you can watch it on video yourself. There are those who are trying to cover form him by saying he wasn't being specific or talking about covid but as I said no one knows when a pandemic will happen they just know they do. no-one can put a date on it and fauci did.

[1975NQ]

7 hours ago, rm2551 said:

The push to go above 90% vaxx rate makes sense from a health/science perspective from what I understand - and I have not heard of credible scientific data/analysis that concludes vaccinations have a net negative effect, so it makes sense from a public health policy perspective from Government to push vaxx to 90% if the Gov. subscribes to the idea that the first duty of care (or at least equal first) is the health and well being of the population.

 

 

+1 to everything you wrote. My take is we're dealing with human nature (in terms of public response to all this and daily behavior) which can never be reasoned with and only learns from pain (sadly). The x factor in this shit show is the long term effects of the vaccine which we won't really know about for many years to come. Hopefully, it's completely benign but presently is a huge unknown. I got the double jab because the math on it from my perspective was that it was by far the lesser risk (vs being exposed to the virus unvaccinated). In terms of constant booster shots every 6 months .. that's gonna be a hard sell for most people who are healthy and not overly vulnerable , myself included.

I personally think the governments of the world did the math on this (specifically with regards to long covid and the huge economic and social upset this will cause over time) and are trying to mitigate as best they can without freaking out the public at large (hence the bullshit messaging). Some are doing a better job than others, most are overstepping a bit (Euro nations are obviously hugely overstepping).

[SteveAJones]

1 hour ago, 1975NQ said:

I personally think the governments of the world did the math on this (specifically with regards to long covid and the huge economic and social upset this will cause over time) and are trying to mitigate as best they can without freaking out the public at large (hence the bullshit messaging). Some are doing a better job than others, most are overstepping a bit (Euro nations are obviously hugely overstepping).

I mean this in the nicest possible way: have you ever considered doing stand up comedy? Because that post is laugh out loud funny! If ANY math was done on this it was how much money can be made and how much political power can be seized in the shortest amount of time possible by convincing the general public a virus with a 98% survival rate is something to be deathly afraid of.

Oh sure. This virus is such a threat to society that when Fauci was asked by a Fox News reporter if quarantines would be applied to illegal aliens flooding the southern border, he claimed “that’s a different issue.”

 

 

[1975NQ]

10 minutes ago, SteveAJones said:

I mean this in the nicest possible way: have you ever considered doing stand up comedy? Because that post is laugh out loud funny! If ANY math was done on this it was how much money can be made and how much political power can be seized in the shortest amount of time possible by convincing the general public a virus with a 98% survival rate is something to be deathly afraid of.

Oh sure. This virus is such a threat to society that when Fauci was asked by a Fox News reporter if quarantines would be applied to illegal aliens flooding the southern border, he claimed “that’s a different issue.”

 

 

We can agree to disagree then. I'm not a CNN or FOX follower and def think Fauci is a joke. I also agree that this pandemic is being used for a money grab, no question. But - using critical thinking here, my friend - long covid is real. IF the studies are correct and 1 out of 5 get long covid, then yep math says we're gonna be fucked if this isn't fixed within a few years.

Try and look at the problem in a non-binary good/bad (us vs them) perspective. There are multiple issues happening simultaneously here. My main concern is long covid, that's just me though.

Your bull in a china shop responses aren't helping your credibility here, in terms of anyone taking you seriously, but then again I can be pretty direct myself lol.

Edited December 3, 2021 by 1975NQ

[3hrsoflunacy]

Using anagrams, we can look at the variants a little different:

Omicron becomes MORONIC

Add the delta and omicron variants together and you get MEDIA CONROL